What would you do ?

[gm280]

Good morning iboaters. I have an interesting dilemma going on. I own a lot of Dewalt 18 volt power hand tools and have for many years now. Problem is nearly all the battery packs are about caput. I have two smart chargers that charge them up and turn off but it seems the packs only run for a very short period of time of about five to maybe ten minute now and are drained once again. There capacities are severely diminished once again. I know they are NiCad 18 volt packs and I have even rebuilt them a few times now with high output NiCads as well. But the cost even to rebuilt them is not cheap either. But I am wondering if it is time to move on to the newer Lithium Ion power tool? While that surely sound like the best thing to do, understand I own two 18 volt 1/2" variable speed drills, a Sawsall type tool, two 3/8" variable speed drills one being a 90 degree for close areas, one skill type circular 18 volt saw, a 18 volt work light. So if I buy all new power tools for the newer power design, it will cost tons of money. So I am trying to think what my options are and what you all would do as well. Cost of buying everything new is surely a factor. Is there another battery pack that would solve my problem(s) other then NiCads? Does anybody know of a Lithium pack that would fit the older 18 volt NiCad design?

 

[204 Escape]

Re: What would you do ?

How does the price of the batteries -vs- the cost of a new set of tools compare? (I know it would depend on how many batteries you buy). The cost of batteries isn't cheap. The smart charger, is it a "Quick charger"? If so, I found out years ago, (in my opinion), that they ruined the batteries by "Quick charging them".

I recently had a battery give out oun my Makita, and the battery itself is $63.00 for ONE battery.

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

204 Escape, I do understand what you are saying. I have about 7 or 8 battery packs and some are older then others and some are high output while the others are not. But the real problem with NiCads are sitting around. If I was to use them daily, it would probably not be as big an issue. But I use them as needed and that could be a long time in between... I even thought about buying the individual Lithium cells and rebuilding them all (again), but I just can't find replacement cells in "C" or "sub C" type packages for Lithium cells... I was hoping for DeWalt to make a Lithium pack for their older 18 volt tools, but I haven't seen anything... :blue:

 

[Georgesalmon]

Re: What would you do ?

Ni-cads develop a memory problem. If you charge them and use a little bit then charge them again after a time they "learn" to go low after a short time. The fix is to discharge them slowly all the way (use your work light for this, just turn it on until the battery is dead, dead, dead) and then charge them all the way up several times to change their memory. It can help a lot to do this but they still wear out after a time. If me, I would have all the batteries rebuilt with lith ion. They also have a memory but not as bad. Look on E-bay, lots of people do this if you can't buy the type of lith-ion you need to do it yourself. I had all mine rebuilt, not cheap but cheaper than all new tools and batteries. I had to get a new charger also.

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

Georesalom, thanks for the replay and answer as well. I do know of the NiCad memory problems. I've even built NiCad recyclers for that very reason to cycle them and erase their memory and restore their capacities...somewhat. But like you said, they do get old. I've actually bought high capacity NiCads individual cells and rebuilt a few packs, but not being used daily has taken its told. I've never seen any Lithium replacement packs or individual cells to rebuild the old 18 volt NiCad packs. Where or who rebuilds them to Lithium packs? Might be an option...

 

[aspeck]

Re: What would you do ?

My charger will "quick charge" if left on for a couple hours, but if left on for more than 8 hours, will discharge the battery completely and then slow charge it back again. I do not leave the batteries in the charger after 1 day. I use mine sparingly, and usually have a little advanced notice, so I let them discharge on their own and then recharge them when it is time to use them. That way I have a fresh charge and avoid a lot of the memory issues. At least it seems that way to me. I also have the angle grinder, the skil saw, the jab saw, the screwdriver/hammer drill, and the flexible light, so lots of tools and batteries. I am going on about 6 or 7 years. Had to replace 1 battery so far.

 

[MTboatguy]

Re: What would you do ?

I went through this exact same thing a couple of years ago with my Ryobi tools, fortunately Home Depot designed their new lith batteries so they would work in their older 18 volt tools, I love the lith batteries, they last a long time and don't seem to have any memory problems, It was expensive to swith over to the new batteries, but they work so much better than the Ni-Cad system.

In looking around the other day, I was sure I saw some Dewalt lith batteries that will fit the older Dewalt tools that started out with Ni-Cad batteries, you might get a hold of Dewalt and see if they have this available..

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

I went through this exact same thing a couple of years ago with my Ryobi tools, fortunately Home Depot designed their new lith batteries so they would work in their older 18 volt tools, I love the lith batteries, they last a long time and don't seem to have any memory problems, It was expensive to swith over to the new batteries, but they work so much better than the Ni-Cad system.

In looking around the other day, I was sure I saw some Dewalt lith batteries that will fit the older Dewalt tools that started out with Ni-Cad batteries, you might get a hold of Dewalt and see if they have this available..

Thanks MTboatguy, I think I'll actually do just that. It has to be better then repurchasing so many DeWalt tool all over again...

 

[bruceb58]

Re: What would you do ?

I just buy new batteries on eBay and rebuild them at a fraction of the cost. If you know how to solder, it's very easy. The batteries you get on ebay that are out now have way more capacity than what the DeWalt batteries originally had too.

By the way, DeWalt has had some quality issues with their Lithium battery packs. I was going to switch over until I read a lot of bad reviews on Amazon.

 

[Fishing Dude too]

Re: What would you do ?

read where if you jolt these batteries they work again but no idea and you would need a 36 v power source

 

[MTboatguy]

Re: What would you do ?

read where if you jolt these batteries they work again but no idea and you would need a 36 v power source

There have been quite a few injuries reported trying to jolt Ni-Cad batteries, not a recommended procedure.

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

I just buy new batteries on eBay and rebuild them at a fraction of the cost. If you know how to solder, it's very easy. The batteries you get on ebay that are out now have way more capacity than what the DeWalt batteries originally had too.

By the way, DeWalt has had some quality issues with their Lithium battery packs. I was going to switch over until I read a lot of bad reviews on Amazon.

bruceb58, I have actually bought the individual cells and rebuilt many packs before. I also built a battery tab welder for doing just that using the silver battery tab material for the connections. But even purchasing the larger capacity cells (largest amp hour ratings) they too get weaker as time goes by. I was looking into finding the Lithium cells to fit the original cases with zero luck. And as posted above as well, I have also zapped cells before using a high current variable power supply. That helps only if the cell has bridges built up internally in the cell. And I also built recyclers and cycled Nicad for years. To do that correctly you have to zero out each cell 'till they read nota, zilch, zero. Then recharge them again. That removes any cell that reversed its polarity. But sooner or later that all doesn't work anymore...or as good. I heard on here that they make Lithium packs to fit my older designed tools, but I haven't located them yet. I may buy one and see how that works out before jumping in and replace them all...

 

[MikDee]

Re: What would you do ?

Electric R.C. cars, boats, and planes, are using C-size lithium ion batterys for a few years now, you should be able to purchase them to build your own packs somewhat inexpensively.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: What would you do ?

Electric R.C. cars, boats, and planes, are using C-size lithium ion batterys for a few years now, you should be able to purchase them to build your own packs somewhat inexpensively.

Except that these packs are sub-c and lithium requires a special charger. Also the Lithium batteries are 3x the voltage so you have to take that into account when you pick the batteries and wire up the packs. Other than that, its easy!

You know of sub-c lithium batteries? Maybe you can point to a website?

 

[bruceb58]

Re: What would you do ?

I heard on here that they make Lithium packs to fit my older designed tools, but I haven't located them yet. I may buy one and see how that works out before jumping in and replace them all...

Yes they do. Here they are:
Amazon.com: DEWALT DC9180-2 18-Volt XRP Lithium-Ion Batteries, 2-Pack: Home Improvement
Here is the charger:
Amazon.com: DEWALT DC9320 Heavy-Duty 7.2 Volt - 18 Volt Dual Port Charger: Home Improvement
Only $280 for the 2 batteries and the charger.

 

[agallant80]

Re: What would you do ?

I have both for my Ridgid tools. The lithium batteries are great, I would not buy nicad any more. Take the plunge you will like them. Best thing is I have had mine for a few years now and they will sit for months at a time in my cold shop and still work great.

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

Yes they do. Here they are:
Amazon.com: DEWALT DC9180-2 18-Volt XRP Lithium-Ion Batteries, 2-Pack: Home Improvement
Here is the charger:
Amazon.com: DEWALT DC9320 Heavy-Duty 7.2 Volt - 18 Volt Dual Port Charger: Home Improvement
Only $280 for the 2 batteries and the charger.

WOW, thanks for that link bruceb58. They are expensive, but if they work, I'll bite. I'm not sure I need to get the chargers because I upgraded to their newer chargers some time back and I think my chargers will work. It covers most all their batteries and voltages like these newer ones specify. I'll check the model numbers and see... I also have a few of their older chargers too. They still work but not like the newer versions...and I'm thinking they would not be worth much trying to blue-light them. Thanks again...

 

[MTboatguy]

Re: What would you do ?

I was sure I had seen the backward compatible 18v liths for the DeWalts, glad to know I was not imagining it.

 

[gm280]

Re: What would you do ?

I was sure I had seen the backward compatible 18v liths for the DeWalts, glad to know I was not imagining it.

MTboatguy, you da man! I didn't doubt you one bit... :high5:

 

[bruceb58]

Re: What would you do ?

I was going to get a new drill that came with the 18V compatible batteries but decided the cost wasn't worth it.

Probably better to just buy a whole new drill to buy the batteries. Not sure these are the same batteries as what I posted before though
http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCD760...1395759865&sr=8-6&keywords=dewalt+18V+lithium

Here are these batteries
http://www.amazon.com/DeWALT-DC9181...1395759865&sr=8-7&keywords=dewalt+18V+lithium