which one is yanking my chain

[yourkiddin]

while at a tracker dealership, i was looking over a brand new left over 06 tournement all fish. the salesman commented that it had an 08 90 mercury. out the door for 17,105.later the same day i was looking over a smokercraft that was an 08 for around the same price and he told me the 2 stroke motors dont have year models anymore. as of like three years ago they stopped saying it was an 06,07 and so on. is this a true statement?

 

[JB]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

I think that is true for Mercs. I haven't heard of anyone else doing it.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

seems like i heard yamaha, or suzuki were doing it also.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

Merc has always refered to serial number rather than years. Yamaha started doing it in 06. 05 was the last production run linked to a year for Yamaha. OMC always had outboards linked to years but anything that fell under the Drive Systems banner (inboard, I/O, jet, Sea Drive, Sail Drive etc) did not have sales years, just model numbers.

 

[109jb]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

They don't use model year designations, but the serial number sticker has the month and year of production on it.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

So why would they stop putting years on it?

I hate to see car manufacturers do that. I'd be shopping for a used car and it would be a GDNX234242WQ24212U9 Corvette. I'd be happier to know it was an '07 Corvette. Makes comparison easier and easier to explain.

 

[JB]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

Stocking was the problem.

They would have brand new, never cranked, engines made up to several years earlier and identical, in all respects, to engines made this year.

That "left over" '06 engine is a good example. It is a new engine and shouldn't be regarded or sold as a "used " engine.

 

[SnappingTurtle]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

So why would they stop putting years on it?

Because people want new, actual model features when buying a “new” motor, at “new” motor prices.

The dealers and manufactures are sitting on three or four year old “new” models that people won't or don't want to pay the same for as for a “new” one that is only several months out of the factory.

It is just a way for manufactures to pawn off their new/old stock on unsuspecting buyers, for the same prices they are asking for their new/new stock.

While still "new" and never used, these motors may, or may not, meet the same specs as those presently produced, but using this new pricing method, they can ask for the same money for these motors.

 

[triumphrick]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

I'd be shopping for a used car and it would be a GDNX234242WQ24212U9 Corvette. I'd be happier to know it was an '07 Corvette.

I'm sorry Nelson, but that GDNX designation with the u9 suffix is an 05....looks like someone is about to get screwed..

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

I'm sorry Nelson, but that GDNX designation with the u9 suffix is an 05....looks like someone is about to get screwed..

Darn, and here I thought I was getting a great deal at $5,000. Maybe I should run that number through the DMV and make sure it's lefit

 

[109jb]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

OK, they aren't sold as a 2006, 2007 or whatever motor, but they have a month and year of production. So you are going to sell one that was manufactured in July 2006. How you gonna describe it? I know I'm gonna say its a 2006 motor. IMO it doesn't change a darn thing for buying or selling.

The reason they went away from it was to avoid confusion. Let's say you buy a motor that was manufactured October 2005 as a 2006 model year motor and wasn't actually sold to you until Early 2007. It was a new motor and the dealer said it's "brand new", which it was. Later you need a part for it and go to the dealer and tell him its a 2007, or you look at the tag and it says manufactured in 2005 and you tell the dealer its a 2005. Do you get the right part??

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

The reason they went away from it was to avoid confusion. Let's say you buy a motor that was manufactured October 2005 as a 2006 model year motor and wasn't actually sold to you until Early 2007. It was a new motor and the dealer said it's "brand new", which it was. Later you need a part for it and go to the dealer and tell him its a 2007, or you look at the tag and it says manufactured in 2005 and you tell the dealer its a 2005. Do you get the right part??

I guess that was more my concern. I have a 2001 Johnson and it was manufactured 12/2000. However, I saw the original invoice from the sales of the boat originally and it was sold new in 04/2002. (When OMC was going belly up, the marine shop bought 15 of them at 50 cents on the dollar)

But, I found the model quite easily on their website. However, with the 'going by model' do they plan to change the services manuals to reflect models and not years (I guess Mercury maybe has already)

I guess it makes sense, just coincided with everything else we purchased that goes by year.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

The OEs that use the non-model year system will tell you it's to allow them to make improvements on any model at any time in a calander year. They may or may not do that. Where it really benifits them (the OE) is with pre-rigged boats (outboards) and I/O, inboards etc. Going by a number rather than a year allows them to install a "2008" motor in a boat titled as a 2009. At one time or another every OE has had to go thru some issues with someone who feels they bought a new boat but got an "old" motor. Going by a model or serieal number gives them the legal language to say "it's a new 2009 boat and a new motor, there is no such thing as a 2008 or 2009 motor".

It also does away with "leftovers" and fire sales at the end of a model year.

Mercury has used this system for years. It can be confusing especially if you don't have the serial number. IE - 1991 was a split year for some of their V6s. Some had top guided rods, some had bottom guided rods. To get the right pistons you have to have the right serial number or know which rods you have. And hope no one had changed them thru the years.

 

[gss036]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

I just went thru that with the purchase of a "new honda", but the sales person told me up front, t was a noncurrent model, ok, and the owners manual says it was a 2006. So I bought a year old motor. There was a $4,000.00+ discount from the price and a Honda 5 year nondeclining warranty, I could have cared less. I know I will be the sole owner for many years to come. A few years down the road, what difference will it make? Probably none.
I read somewhere last week the the E-Tec's will still have a model year desingnation on them.

 

[d.boat]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

I just went thru that with the purchase of a "new honda", but the sales person told me up front, t was a noncurrent model, ok, and the owners manual says it was a 2006. So I bought a year old motor. There was a $4,000.00+ discount from the price and a Honda 5 year nondeclining warranty, I could have cared less. I know I will be the sole owner for many years to come. A few years down the road, what difference will it make? Probably none..

I think you've hit the nail on the head: functionally it makes no difference assuming there's been no functional changes from manufacturing year to year, and the warranty should be full since it's never been used.

On the other hand, you did get a good discount because....the reality is that - at least in the short term - the model year, or perceived model year (based on mfgr year) will indeed have an impact on resale value simply because of common perceptions.

To the a buyer of a newish (say 2-5 years old) used engine, absent any objective data, an 06 will be thought to be in service two years longer than an 08, regardless of when you say you bought it, or even if you have a receipt. This will undoubtedly even out after 10 years or so (who cares if a used outboard is 9 or 11 years old - you buy based strictly based on your evaluation of the condition).

That's why you would expect and did receive a discount when purchasing new old stock. It's a good deal for you because you don't care what the short term resale value is, you get full warranty and know that the old stock engine is identical to the new one. It's exactly the type of situation I would look for.

 

[ziemann]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

To ANSWER the original question-

Reality is that both dealers have most likely represented their boats accurately, and both want your business. So, I would say if the dollars are equal, buy the '08 Smokercraft....

 

[109jb]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

To ANSWER the original question-

Reality is that both dealers have most likely represented their boats accurately, and both want your business. So, I would say if the dollars are equal, buy the '08 Smokercraft....

We did ANSWER the question that was asked which was:

...he told me the 2 stroke motors dont have year models anymore. as of like three years ago they stopped saying it was an 06,07 and so on. is this a true statement?

He DID NOT ask which boat he should buy.

 

[SnappingTurtle]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

Both dealers sound like they have been honest with you, and if I was in the States right now I would not really care if it was marked with a year or not. When I order parts, they want the serial number, and not the year anyway.

The problem here (Germany/Switzerland/Austria) is that the government keeps changing the emission requirements for outboard motors for certain lakes and rivers.

People are trying to buy motors, that meet these continually changing requirements.

By removing the model years from these motors, they, the dealers & manufactures, have increased their chances of selling these new/old stock motors, although they no-longer meet the new emission requirements for certain areas.

While I would not normally care what year a motor was labeled as, I would be really pissed if I bought one, and found out that it could not be used on my local lake, and was worthless on the local used market, because it didn't meet the new local emission standard.

It is happening. eBay sellers here, are now putting this in some online descriptions, as the reason for the sale. They are offering their newly purchased (but old model) motors, because they can't use them.

 

[triumphrick]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

One more thing that I have yet to see posted, and that is a reference to the motors hour meter. On most motors of any considerable size and value there is an hour meter that, to me, is more valuable in determining the value of the motor than the age.
I just bought a 6 year old boat/motor combo with 63 hours showing, and to me it greatly increased the value of thepackage. However while looking at NADA or other guides, I could not find a reference to the motor hours. How much more could I have added to the motors value? The high end retail for the 150 Yamaha on this boat was only $4500. A2003 was worth $4800, a 2001 was worth $4000. The only footnote by nada said motors in exceptional condition were worth "significantly more". What does that mean?
Anyway, all in all I was happy to get what I got for what I got it for and used the hour meter and the overall cleanliness of both boat, motor and trailer to help verify the low hours. My .02, for what it may be worth....

 

[SnappingTurtle]

Re: which one is yanking my chain

One more thing that I have yet to see posted, and that is a reference to the motors hour meter. On most motors of any considerable size and value there is an hour meter that, to me, is more valuable in determining the value of the motor than the age.

I am not sure just how reliable those electronic hour meters on outboards are when judging an engines age or usage.

In Europe it cost about 50 Euros, a lap top, and 5 minutes total time, to roll back the mileage on your high value German cars onboard computer.

The onboard computer is just one of many things (often the last), car experts look at here when setting, or judging the value of a used car.

The German version of the American FBI says, a low estimate of all expensive used cars sold in Germany, at least 50% have had the mileage rolled back.

It is just a matter of time till it happens with outboards in the States, if is not already being done.