Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

[big_b]

Hello all ,
I am very new to boats .. I need some help with the 1977 Viking Deck boat I bought.
It has a AQ130 Volvo Penta Motor and the 280T outdrive.

The electric motor for the trim/tilt is not working .. I have tested and the motor itself needs replaced. I can drop the out drive all the way down and it locks in ... (is this only for reverse?) Should I drive forward with it all the way down ? Seems like I need to trim it up some..

The problem is at full throttle I am barely moving at 10MPH...(The motor revs great in neutral) The bow raises up alot .. maybe 2 feet ... I have no power increase from 1/4 throttle to full throttle but motor bogs down like its under heavy load. .. I am thinking it is a trim issue right ? Is the motor to lock all the way down only for reverese ?


Also the ignition may be wired wrong, can someone tell me how it should be wired...

Right now it is wired with 12V constant to + side of coil then from negative side of coil goes to the distributor. I cannot kill the motor with the key anymore.. How is the kill switch wired ? I made one by wiring from the dist to a switch and then to ground...

Any suggestions on how I can get this thing to perform right ? The guy I bought it off of said it woudl run 35MPH easy ...

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Welcome to iboats!
First thing - I don't think there's a model AQ280T outdrive. There's a 270T with power trim and also a 280 with a tilt mechanism. You need to figure out which one you have. Might as well head on up to the "Adults only" section and download your manuals for the engine and outdrive. You should really chew on those for awhile to get a good idea of how your engine and outdrive work.

Second thing is that the two issues of trim and power have nothing to do with each other. Your engine isn't producing power so start there. It's best to start with a fresh tuneup, compression test, and good fuel before you try any more serious troubleshooting. There are just too many unknowns to know where to start. The tuneup will also help you get familiar with the engine as well as the manual and things will start to make more sense.

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Sorry .. got it wrong .. I have the AQ130 Motor and the 280 OutDrive with the tilt (it locks in down position when all the way down..

Just to make sure .. your saying that with the motor all the way down and the bow up 2 feet from forward motion .. it should exceed 8 or 10MPH ? There is no need to tilt the motor up to get it to go faster ?

I am going to do a compression check on it tonight and set the timing .. I have set timing on cars many times with my timing light .. Where is the timing mark (where do I point the light) on the Volvo ?

Sorry for the newbie questions .. I am reading the manuals trying to understand them all .. What PSI should I get on the compression gage ?

Thanks,
Branden

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

With the trim - there are three positioning holes in the bottom of the transom shield for adjustment. You move the thru bolt to one of the three positions. That's all the trim adjust you have. Your issue of bow up indicates that there isn't enough power to get on plane. You could move the bolt to the most forward position but doubt that'll do it. And yes - the outdrive should lock in place when down in forward or reverse. The motor and mechanism you're seeing is for outdrive tilt - not trim. It's only for trailering or idle speed. Use it at higher RPM's and the repairs will get expensive real quick! You can troubleshoot the tilt mechanism, motor, and relays later.

As far as the engine - by all means, check the timing AND the advanced timing. You'll be able to find the timing hash mark when you have the plugs out doing the compression test. Compression specs are at the beginning of the specification section of the manual. Starts on page 45. Let it warm up first and do the test both dry and wet to see what's goint on.

That engine likes to have the timing set correctly to even start so it's probably close - just make sure you check the advanced timing as well. Timing specs are on page 49.

Just remember that you're dealing with all unknowns until you verify everything. It might be not enough spark or not at the right time, it might be insufficient compression, it might be not enough or contaminated fuel, or a dirty and clogged carb. Everything is suspect at this point - spark plugs, wires, dist cap, rotor, carb, water in fuel, junk in fuel, excessive blowby, etc., etc., etc.

The fact that it even starts and stays running is a good sign. Just methodically work through everything - squeeze, fuel, and fire - all at the right time!

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

OK I will report back this evening on what I find with the compression and timing .. I reall appreciate your help ! I will report back this evening with the status...

I guess I am a little confused as the timing mark still .. I will see it when I remove the plugs for the compression test ? (I alread replaced the cap,rotor, plugs, and wires)

So there will be a mark on there somewhere ? It won't let me look at that document here at work .. So I will have to figure out how the advance timing works .. If I am thinkning corrrectly .. it needs to be a certain degrees at idle and then a certain degrees advance at a certain RPM .. THis is all done by just rotating the dist cap right ? Even for the advance ?

Thanks again,

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Just to make sure .. your saying that with the motor all the way down and the bow up 2 feet from forward motion .. it should exceed 8 or 10MPH ? There is no need to tilt the motor up to get it to go faster ?
Thanks,
Branden

Are you sure the outdrive is all the way down? With the problems you've indicated with the tilt mechanism, wanted to make sure the vice rod on the tilt mechanism isn't partially down and pushing the outdrive up and away from the transom.

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

I believe so .. The tilt motor is all the way in the down position. The tilt motor does not work, so I have to raie it up and strap the outdrive by hand for transport.. WHen I drop the outdrive by hand it clicks into place and I am unable to pull it up unless I reach under and pull the realease behind the outboard .. It stays locked down as far as I can tell I never see it coming up.. The motor does backfire at full throttle and if I goose the throttle up it will want to die... I have to easily push the throttle up .. The motor sounds like it struggleing anything over 1/4 to 1/2 throttle .. (sounds like a car trying to make it up a hill in a high gear)

I guess I will learn alot about the problem when I do the compression check tonight ...

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

OK I will report back this evening on what I find with the compression and timing .. I reall appreciate your help ! I will report back this evening with the status...

I guess I am a little confused as the timing mark still .. I will see it when I remove the plugs for the compression test ? (I alread replaced the cap,rotor, plugs, and wires)

So there will be a mark on there somewhere ? It won't let me look at that document here at work .. So I will have to figure out how the advance timing works .. If I am thinkning corrrectly .. it needs to be a certain degrees at idle and then a certain degrees advance at a certain RPM .. THis is all done by just rotating the dist cap right ? Even for the advance ?

Thanks again,

Well - I was hoping that you would be able to turn the engine over by hand with the spark plugs removed to find the mark. Was also assuming that you knew where to look. It's on the front of the engine on the flywheel damper. The "arrow" is a cast piece on the aluminum timing gear cover. It's just above and to the left of the brass water pump. There is a picture of it on page 40 of the manual.

From the manual, your timing should be 12 degrees BTDC at idle. Since it starts, it's probably set pretty close. Since you can't get the engine to increase RPM while under load, timing advance (or lack of it) could be one of the problems. As you increase speed toward 2000 rpm, timing should gradually increase to 27 to 29 degrees. If not then you've got problems with the advance springs or weights.

You should check to see which engine you have but the 130D typically came with the AQ280 outdrive and has the twin Solex carbs. The name plate is rivited to the engine just aft of the starter. Since the manual doesn't list the D model, use the specs for the C. The Seloc manual has all the specs for the 130D model if you want them but it's not much different than the C. Some will swear at the Solec manual but I find it a great place to keep all my notes, compression readings, part numbers, and it works well as a kneepad while working in the boat!

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

I just checked the compression .. I couldn't get it started so these are cold numbers ... (cyl#1) 130psi (cyl #2) 130 psi (cyl #3) 120 psi (cyl #4) 100psi

Not the nest numbers at all .. Are they bad enough to think about a rebuild ?

I could not get it started to check the timing... I have no spark now .. I found that if you leave a coil grounded it kills it (made a kill switch)

I put the old ignition coil back on (tested 3.5 ohms) and pulled a spark plug and laid on block bolt .. no spark at all ... I ordered an electronic ignition today to replace the points ... Could the points be bad causing all of this ? ALso something to note .. when I pulled the plugs .. they were wet with fuel and black sooty ... I am pretty sure I flooded it though ...

What ya think ? Also, I found the timing mark .. thanks !

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

The compression numbers show that the engine is getting pretty tired. Warm numbers are usually better and you would want to test each cylinder again after adding a teaspoon of oil. Number 4 sounds pretty bad. If it's been sitting for a long time, those numbers might improve after it's warmed up good and it's been run a few hours to reseat the rings. Realistically, that's a "keep your fingers crossed" type of thing. Really need to get it running again and see. My 130D was similir but not quite as bad and now after being run for 30-40 hours is consistently at 160 and 170 dry. Not stellar but still has quite bit of life yet.

Glad to hear you're getting rid of the points and resister. Makes the ignition wiring and starting circuit that much simpler. The plugs are wet because it's pumping gas in and it's not being burned. It's also because it hasn't been running at temperature. Poor compression doesn't help either.

Double check your plug wires. Correct firing order is 1342. It's just one more thing to verify since it doesn't seem to want to accelerate.

Haven't gotten to the point of checking the carbs yet. I suspect that the accelerator pumps aren't squirting and that's another thing, along with no timing advance, wrong firing order, and possibly bad fuel that can be affecting acceleration.

Having a boat and engine that old means that you can't take anything for granted. Everything has to be verified correct. Fuel lines and vents, wiring, cables, etc. could be different or changed around to make something work on some particular day. In some ways it makes things easier - you know you have to trace it out and then you know it's right (or not).

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

BIG BREAKTHROUGH !!

I checked the firing order and cyl 2 and 3 plug wires were swtiched .. I put them back on like they came off of the baot when I got them .. I went ahaed an chenged to the correct order and put the old coil back on and found a fue had blown for the ignition switch ... It runs and seems to sound good now ..

Now my problem is I cannot see the timing marks on the pulley .. I barely see them sitting still .. I put a touch white paint on it to see it and can see that with the light .. Can you tell me where what the marks are on it .. I think I see a 10 20 30 40 marks but was not sure if I adjust for the number or the mark next to it for 12 degrees ... Also How can I kill this motor without having to pull the dist wire all the time ? The key off position does not kill the motor ...

I hope this thing runs better now on the water ....

 

[captmello]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

the wire on the Pos terminal of the coil needs to come off of the ignition switch. Looks like a green wire in the manual.

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Green wire is on positive ... Iget about 9.5v when switch is on ... - side goes to distrobutor cap .. There is also a grey wire that has to be hooked to - side in order for it to fire ....


How in the heck to do I kill the boat ? Why is the switch not working ?

Thanks,

 

[captmello]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

The switch may be shot. The grey wire is the feed for the Tach. The engine should run without the grey wire hooked up.

Can you trace the green wire to the switch??

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

I can't trace it back all the way to switch .. but with my voltmeter I get voltage when the switch is on ... and nothing with the switch off ... for some reaon I get no spark without the grey wire hooked to the minus side ... It has no voltage on it though ...

How does the off switch work ? Dows it ground the coil somewhere ?

Anyone have a closeup of the timing marks I can see ? So I can set my timing ? Also how do I adjust idle speed .. it seems vey high .. I amreading thorugh the manual .. just alot to take in ...

Thanks,

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Yeee Haaa - it's running!

Picture of the timing marks is on page 40 of the manual. I'll attach a thumbnail of the page as well. Like I said before, it's probably close. You really want to be observing that the timing advances as you increase rpm's. Exact numbers aren't as important as finding out if it's advancing. The plug wires were most likely the major problem but allways verify.

Probably a good idea to adjust the timing before setting the idle. Idle is set on each carb with the large screw that is near the front of each carb. If you look close, you'll see two adjusting screws on each carb. The one farthest forward is the idle speed adjust. The one in about the center is the idle mixture screw. Don't mess with the mixture screws just yet. Yo'll need to adjust he idle speed screws one at a time and get a feel for them. Pick one and turn it out a quarter turn. If no change, turn the one on the other carb. Blip the throttle between adjustments to get the linkage to settle in. You'll be having one carb lead the adjustments. Just turn the other carb adjust screw so that they're both the same. It's a little hard to explain but i think it'll make more sense when you start doing it.

Remember that it'll idle faster out of the water without backpressure on the exhaust so set it around 800-900. Also make sure it's warmed up (it probably is by now) when you do the adjusments. Since there aren't any chokes on the carbs, you'll need to adjust idle with the throttle until it warms up.

The ignition switch doesn't short out to stop the engine - it opens so there is no current flow. Now we're in that grey area where what the wiring is supposed to look like may be totally different from what it actually is. You're going to need to trace the wiring back through the wiring harness plug and to the ignition switch. Been there - done that - invented some new curse words

At least you're on to a good start.

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Yep finally running again ! Thanks for all your help so far ! I really appreciate it .. Since my Tach does not work (pulled the tach out and hooked directly to battery and the sensor terminal to the - side of the coil and it didn't work).. I am going to buy one tomorrow and install before I set the timing ... If the idle is running at like 1500RPM .. then how can I set the timing ? just go ahead and set it at the 2000 RPM setting ?
I cannot wait to get this thing out on the water and see if I can break 10MPH ! I would say the firing order being wrong really killed the power. By the way I have attached a pic of my first boat !

 

[captmello]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

I always liked those viking deck boats. First I've seen with a VP.

I cannot wait to get this thing out on the water and see if I can break 10MPH ! I would say the firing order being wrong really killed the power !

Can't argue with that. I'll bet it runs much better. Have you checked your raw water impeller and inspected the bellows and outdrive oil?

Take your time, Like PP40 said, with old boats you need to check everything over before heading out.

You can overlook one thing and breakdown on the water and/or do very expensive damage to the engine or outdrive. Those aq130's are getting tougher to find these days. Good old engines though, my family an an even older aq120a when I was a kid. Very similar engine.

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Nice looking boat!

Didn't realize the idle was that high. Bring it down to 900 to 1000 and set the initial timing. If the advance is working like it should then the idle needs to be down at a reasonable level.

Seems odd that it won't run without the tach wire hooked up. Sounds like it's acting as a ground. Of course, that's another "joy" of owning an older boat!

EDIT: Let's think about the ignition wiring issue again. If it's hooked up correctly, there should be a green wire from the switch going to the (+) side of the coil. There should be another green wire going from the (-) side of the coil to the distributor. The gray wire for the tach should be on the (-) side. You're saying that with the switch in the off position there is no power to the coil on the plus side. With the ignition switch on, you're saying that you now have power to the coil. You're also saying that when the engine is running and you turn off the switch, the engine stays running and won't stop unless you short out the gray wire. Did you actually check to see if there is still power being supplied to the (+) side of the coil through the green wire when the key is in the off position? If the engine runs without power to the coil, you've got some sort of FM going on

 

[big_b]

Re: Volvo Penta AQ130 and 280T outdrive help for new boater

Yea it is wierd .. I looked at so many wires the other day .. I will re-check .. From what I remember ... The green wire only has power when the switch is on .. I verified no current by switching it off .. I have not tried running a new wire as it is actually red on the switch .. SO who knows who ran what where on that thing .. SO when I kill power to the coil by removing the voltage on the green wire .. the boat should turn off ? I am thinking I need to buy a new ignition switch ... It is getting hard to use anyway ..

I will pick up a tach today .. hopefully the auto parts store will have something close in design lol... Then I will bring the idle down using the two screws and then adjust the timing ... It looks like I will be playing back and forth with the timing and the idle until I get them right with each other ... After that I will check to see if the timing is advancing when throttle is applied to 2000 RPM .. Sounds like I should take off work early today before all the rain comes tomorrow to work on it ...

Thanks for the compliment !