Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

jcbache

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Well then Mr Dog, if it was me, I'd get to pullin' those heads. Don't forget the PB Blaster. Makes life a little easier. Good Luck
 

thumpar

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Well then Mr Dog, if it was me, I'd get to pullin' those heads. Don't forget the PB Blaster. Makes life a little easier. Good Luck
Don't pull anything until after full testing. Once you pull the heads there is no way to do compression tests, leakdown tests or any other pressure vacuum tests. Just wait until you have diagnosed it before ripping it apart.
 

jcbache

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

I bet the leak down test shows the cylinders are leaking down excessively on 3 and 6 ( at least). Then what?
 

thumpar

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

I bet the leak down test shows the cylinders are leaking down excessively on 3 and 6 ( at least). Then what?
Actually with the wet vs dry compression test it sounds more like head.
 

achris

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Don't pull anything until after full testing. Once you pull the heads there is no way to do compression tests, leakdown tests or any other pressure vacuum tests. Just wait until you have diagnosed it before ripping it apart.

Top class advice right there....

If it was mine, I'd be pulling the engine and doing a full rebuild (sump plug to oil filler cap), but he's young, short of cash and experience, so let's just do all the testing we can to prove EXACTLY what the problem is and where and take it from there....

Good diagnostics saves money and time.... Every time!

What I would suggest that will make things a lot easier, is to remove the exhaust manifolds now. They have to come off regardless of any outcome, and with them out of the way getting to the spark plug holes will be a lot easier, and if it's an exhaust valve leak, you'll be able hear it and isolate it a lot easier...

Chris......
 
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jcbache

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

My opinion he's done all the diagnostics necessary. Found low compression in two cylinders on opposite sides of the engine. Did a wet compression test to rule out cracked pistons, broken rings, cracked block ( no appreciable change in compression when oil introduced to cylinders). Had no excessive noise from bottom end or top end, pretty much ruling out broken valve spring or valve lock. Problem should be from the deck of the block up and not anything that would make alot of clatter like a dropped valve ( he would have pretty much zero compression anyway). No matter what, In my opinion, he has to remove the cylinder heads ( both). After doing that he should have them inspected and reconditioned ( or exchanged). Then the the problem will show itself. I'll bet it's head gaskets and not multiple valves on opposite sides but who knows. Either way, if he wants to fix it the heads have to come off. He said it did get overheated. He never winterized the thing. Could all come from cracks, leaks, problems in cooling system. Whatever caused it in the first place needs to be corrected as well. My 2 cents.
 
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tpenfield

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

It is always a good thing to do as much testing as you can before opening the engine up (IMHO); because once you open the engine up, you are more limited to inspection & test methods (mostly visual).

It is fairly obvious that the heads need to come off, but it would be nice to know if it is the valves or possibly head gaskets or other possibilities. Most likely valves, but in that case it would be good to know if it is intake valve(s) or exhaust valve(s).

Question of the day . . . (as I was thinking about this possible scenario) . . . what if the low compression cylinders come in 'Good' on the leak test . . . what would that tend to indicate???
 

84EdH

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Crack in cyl wall below height of piston at TDC
 

BigDog98

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Well its not even the problem in the money. The problem is that i have put in at least over 8 large into the boat over the 2 years and i still see no improvement because the engine is still bad.I mean if there are a lot of problems with the engine then i will seriously consider putting maybe 2 or 3 more k into the full rebuild. I mean after all i was planing on it anyway. Nothing good can come from a engine that was kept in salt water all the years and never winterized.
 

achris

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Well its not even the problem in the money. The problem is that i have put in at least over 8 large into the boat over the 2 years and i still see no improvement because the engine is still bad.I mean if there are a lot of problems with the engine then i will seriously consider putting maybe 2 or 3 more k into the full rebuild. I mean after all i was planing on it anyway. Nothing good can come from a engine that was kept in salt water all the years and never winterized.

That describes all my engines... :lol: And nothing bad ever came of those... I think ALL your problems are due to the overheats....
 

jcbache

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Whether it's an intake or exhaust valve(s) or bad head gaskets or badly cracked heads ( or all of the above) doesn't really matter at this point, does it? You can keep "testing" til the cows come home and that won't fix the problem. The low cylinders will not come in "good" on a leakdown test. We know that compression has been lost in those cylinders ( and it's a lot of compression, not just a little. Something is broken). There should be no crack large enough to cause this amount of compression loss in the block in two cylinders on opposite sides that would not have been sucking large amounts of oil into the cylinders and burning it off ( lots of oil smoke). That's why I asked what the plugs looked like and if there was excessive smoke. The wet compression test should have effectively "sealed" any crack(s) from top dead center down and compression would have jumped up ( temporarily of course) indicating a problem below top dead center ( including a crack in the cylinder walls). I think the one last "test" he needs to do is the "visual inspection" test. Sometimes the the best test for an expedient remedy. Ultimately that will be the final test and an inevitable one. JMHO
 
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tpenfield

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Yea, I was thinking that if the connecting rods were bent from mild hydrolocking on the 'low' cylinders, then the leak test may come in fine on those. that would indicate more of a lower-end rebuild. So, if the test can be had without too much trouble, the added information can only help.

I figure that it is in the realm of possibilities considering the extremely high psi readings on some of the other cylinders.
 

jcbache

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Big dog never indicated a hydro-locked engine. I think to bend multiple connecting rods it would have had to happen at high rpm and he would have stopped dead in the water. Starter motor doesn't have the H.P. to do it.
 
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ONEGA

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

I'm with Chris on doing leak down test for a simple reason: it never hurts to get extra experience on diagnosing engine problem for a guy who wants to turn wrenches himself and do a job he feels like doing.
And havining manifolds removed now will make a job a LOT easier.
 

harleyman1975

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Also Bigdog is LEARNING how to do things the right way (thououghly). This will help him in the future (someday he will be the guy answering" how to" questions on this board). His answers will start out like this. "A long time ago I was taught..." Do the test and then you will have all the info in front of you. You will have confidence in yourself as well as the respect of any machine shop you end up dealing with. You will be able to tell them exactly what the symptoms are so they can assist you in only repairing what needs repairing.
 

BigDog98

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

That describes all my engines... :lol: And nothing bad ever came of those... I think ALL your problems are due to the overheats....

Yea i think so too. And not winterizing the boat for 3 straight years.
 

BigDog98

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Also Bigdog is LEARNING how to do things the right way (thououghly). This will help him in the future (someday he will be the guy answering" how to" questions on this board). His answers will start out like this. "A long time ago I was taught..." Do the test and then you will have all the info in front of you. You will have confidence in yourself as well as the respect of any machine shop you end up dealing with. You will be able to tell them exactly what the symptoms are so they can assist you in only repairing what needs repairing.

Yea. Thanks. Thats the plan!!!!
 

BigDog98

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Yea, I was thinking that if the connecting rods were bent from mild hydrolocking on the 'low' cylinders, then the leak test may come in fine on those. that would indicate more of a lower-end rebuild. So, if the test can be had without too much trouble, the added information can only help.

I figure that it is in the realm of possibilities considering the extremely high psi readings on some of the other cylinders.

Yea the other cylinders are really bothering me. A friend of mine told me that when he had high PSI numbers on his engine then the mechanic had told him to replace the engine, and i really dont want to do that unless i have too!
 

xjdriver

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Re: Cylinders Low In PSI ? (HELP)

Yea the other cylinders are really bothering me. A friend of mine told me that when he had high PSI numbers on his engine then the mechanic had told him to replace the engine, and i really dont want to do that unless i have too!
Thats bs, its either your gauge, or there may be fluid in the cyls.
 
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