Iraq

[Ralph 123]

Re: Iraq

It is better to be feared than to be loved. <br /><br />Name one great power that was ever loved?<br /><br />We hadn't done a dman thing and they killed 3,000 of us. If we had responded to the embassy bombings and the bombing of the Cole there never would have been a 911. How many similar attacks have there been since we acted? I rest my case!<br /><br />You think people are going to stop trading with us over Iraq? Are you joking or what? In case you haven't realized we run trade deficits with just about every country on the planet!<br /><br />For the most part we have been greeted a liberators. A few dead-enders does not a wide spread uprising make...

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Iraq

Actually, Cheney, on Meet The Press, said in March that the intelligence said that the Iraqi people would welcome us with open arms as liberators, and that he expected a short war and a long happy peace.

Well, two out of three ain't bad! A few more months it may be three for three!<br /><br />Dang Ply! Your company is on the upswing, yet you cry a foul economy.<br />We've not lost 200 men in a major military action and all but gotten the Ace of Spades and you cry we're loosing.<br />There will be church bells ringing tomorrow in your nieghborhood and you say you don't feel safe.<br />Your belly's full and your bed will be soft and clean tonight, yet you see a pile of problems.<br /><br />Alright then, call me stupid, out of touch, closed minded and ignorant. Cuz, I refuse to go where your at!!<br /><br />Ply, how's the boat been running lately? Been doin' any fishin'? I understand how busy we can get sometimes............but I've heard said......."If your to busy to go fishin', your just toooo busy"..........

 

[lakeman1999]

Re: Iraq

Like all liberals plywoody, you are two faced. Things that effect the rest of us you have liberal ethics, then when it comes to your welfare, you sound like a capitalist. <br />Do not deny it, just go back and read your statements in your past post, and your answers to the restof uor postings.

 

[sharkcat]

Re: Iraq

Hi guys,the terrorists are active down here as well with yet another bomb in indonesia.Whatever we do we cannot interrupt our way of life,sure we have to be more observant & more careful but if we stop doing what we do the insignificant little ragtops have won.Thank you George for having the balls to do something about it & to all the bleeding hearts that dont agree go & offer your condolences to the relatives of the iraqies that saddam tested his biological weapons on

 

[aspeck]

Re: Iraq

I is sad that the minority of Muslims, the extremests, are getting the majority of air time. I know that when I am in Ghana I am daily dealing with Muslims - more of them than Christians. I am taking them to lunch, or they are taking me. I have been invited to vacation with them in Egypt, Lebanon, and Saudi when they go back to visit the family.<br /><br />With each one I meet, I am amazed, because there has not been one that has said to me that America was wrong in what they did, or are doing (since Saddam left power - a few that said we were wrong up to the time he departed). They are truly happy that the vocal, extreme minority that want to fight Christians are on the run. They are the ones to point out to me that their father, Abraham, is the same as our father, Abraham. It is only a family squabble and should not escalate to bloodshed.<br /><br />I used to think that there was no hope for peace between Christians and Muslims, but after meeting with and dealing with so many, I know think that if the media didn't keep fueling the fire, there could be hope ...<br /><br />Maybe I am just a dreamer, but if I can make friends with Muslims, and they can make friends with me, then there is hope for the rest of the world! Just keep praying and don't listen to the media and the most vocal ones!

 

[plywoody]

Re: Iraq

I don't know what you mean by saying I am two-faced?<br /><br />I think you have a slanted, distorted view of what it means to be a liberal. That is what right wing radio likes to do, BTW, is portray liberals the way the think they look, as opposed to the way they are, and then tear them down. It is easy if you get to make up out of wholecloth the target. Or take an out of date, out of context quote from someone, and use it over and over and over again.<br /><br />I am definitely a free market capitalist. No question. I am for free trade, and free markets. I am for environmental regulations that make sense, and not discarding them when special interests come knocking. Everyone gets to play by the same rules. <br />I believe the only way to make this a safer world is to help develop the economy of the rest of the world where possible. Throwing our weight around like some schoolyard bully around the world just increases the problems, and will never solve them.<br /><br />And all of the great progress of the 20th century in the world, and in this country, have come at the hands of liberals, from FDR on down.<br /><br />And as much as the right would like to demonize as traitors anyone left of center, the majority of Americans wish to be fair, compassionate, care about others and the environment, etc. and wish to leave this country as a better place for their children. <br /> All things that liberals hold dear.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Iraq

Throwing our weight around like some schoolyard bully around the world just increases the problems, and will never solve them.

What about WWI or WWII? You don't think those problems were solved by might and might alone? What would you have done, what Chamberlin, et al did at Munich with Hitler? History has shown time and again appeasement does not work.<br /><br />People like you rather pay bullies your lunch money to go away, or cross the street when they see him coming. Professional victims.<br /><br />The Liberals of yesteryear bear no resemblence to the liberal neo socialist/communists of today.<br /><br />By the way, the father of the GOP, one of the greates Presidents ever, Lincoln, did more for the future of this country than any other 5 presidents combined. TR, the biggest environmentalist president ever was a member of the GOP<br /><br />Remember PW, your party went to war to defend slavery and your party has an ex-KKK leader as one of its leaders! If you think domination by your party over the last 50 years has improved the condition of this country you must be living in a different one than most of us are.<br /><br />Your own people would burn down your lumber business in a heartbeat if given a chance! They would rather save a tree than human.<br /><br />Do you just not know anything about history or are you brainwashed by your own propaganda?

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Iraq

You know PW, it is difficult to debate you. You make an assertion, it gets refuted, and 99% of the time you just simply move on to the next assertion. You rarely if ever respond directly. Why is that?

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Iraq

"People like you"? learn from my recent idiocy and<br />don't get personal guys! debating a topic is another<br />story however....<br />only history can truly judge the outcome.<br />I believe it will favor the decision.<br />peace,<br />M.Y.

 

[jimchere]

Re: Iraq

Well said Ralph.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Iraq

You know PW, it is difficult to debate you. You make an assertion, it gets refuted, and 99% of the time you just simply move on to the next assertion. You rarely if ever respond directly.

It isn't difficult Ralph, it's a slam dunk. Just for those reasons. <br />It's become fun to follow him around, refute what he says with fair reason, common sense and facts, and move to another topic.<br /><br />Shoot in another month or so, I'm likely to be the only one posting back at him!

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Iraq

Skinnywater, <br /><br />Your are probably right. I was wondering why I even bothered.

 

[SCO]

Re: Iraq

PW"And all of the great progress of the 20th century in the world, and in this country, have come at the hands of liberals, from FDR on down."<br />This is pure baloney. FDR did a good job holding fast in WWII post Pearl. That's where his reputation came from , not his works programs. WWII ended the depression , not those programs. Tell us some other great liberal success stories.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Iraq

And all of the great progress of the 20th century in the world, and in this country, have come at the hands of liberals, from FDR on down.

Dang, and I thought it was the hard working, innovative people of this country that did this.<br />You suggest that liberals and FDR deserve all the credit. <br /><br />

And as much as the right would like to demonize as traitors anyone left of center, the majority of Americans wish to be fair, compassionate, care about others and the environment, etc. and wish to leave this country as a better place for their children. <br />All things that liberals hold dear.

Not as traitors, but as socialists. <br />The vast majority of Americans do wish to be fair compassionate, care about others and the environment and wish to leave this place better for our children, absolutely.<br /><br />As a conservative, I want to teach people to do for themselves. I want people to be independent of government, to work hard, make good money to afford thier own necessities of life. <br />I beleive that families have primary responsibility to care for their sick and elderly.<br />And charity comes from a strong moral community.<br />I want people to make the effort to come here legally, not to start out by breaking the laws of the land.<br />I detest redistribution of wealth. It is counterproductive to hard work, innovation and charity. <br />I prefer honesty. Even if it's cold, hard and the most difficult route.<br />This includes the concept that we all have equal opportunity and the chance to become as great as you can. But this doesn't automatically guarentee an equal lifestyle.<br />People are also part of the environment and should be taken into an equal balance.<br />I beleive The Constitution is better left alone as to form a more perfect Union.<br />I want a small government and a powerful people.<br /><br />If I'm in err, I'll always default to god, family, country and conservatism.<br /><br />I get the feeling all that is so bad to FDR and the liberals that they had such a need to change it. But honestly and quite frankly, I'm danged mad enough to spit in old FDR's eye fer all that "great progress." <br /><br />Now don't get me wrong ply, you can do what you want, and how you want to do it. I just feel a strong need to resist you at socializing this country when there are so many socialist countries to chose from.<br /><br />Is any of this making sense yet?<br />Because as a caring and conserned conservative, I'm really trying to make a connection here ply.<br />I understand the state of affairs have you all up tight, a little scared, and I'm really trying to help.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Iraq

Hmmm....? difficult to debate? Interesting.<br /><br />I was called "two faced". I asked specifically why. I then was called names and said I changed the subject, yet no one volunteered to explain why I was two faced.<br /><br />And then I was called a socialist.<br /><br />Yep, really difficult to debate. Apparently without any facts you simply need to dig out the labels and the inflamatory adjectives and call it debate. I am glad I am not your high-school english teacher and debate coach!<br /><br />Oh, and let's see. FDR. How about the SEC, and social security, among numerous other things.<br /><br />And LBJ, and equal rights...<br /><br />I understand that you need go back a century and a half to find a decent GOP leader--Lincoln--but then he hardly represents the GOP of today, I am afraid.

 

[SCO]

Re: Iraq

Yes Skinny, what works is when each small economic unit( the family) works to take care of itself, even in the socalist model except fewer economic units support the whole ball of wax since the smaller units dont have the incentive to to do anything but that required by force. That is why the USSR failed, and why socialism doesnt work. The greed component is quite necessary. Now, if humans were bees, we would work till we dropped for the sake of the hive or the "Collective" for all you Star Trek fans. We arent bees. The way to get humans to work hard is to have them working for their own self interest.

 

[dakotashooter2]

Re: Iraq

Getting back on the subject, "God helps those who help themselves". The US is now being blamed for not getting the infrastructure back on its feet, a difficult task when your dodging bullets while you work. If the people of Iraq wnat our help they need to help us too, by policing their own. They seem to be willing to give their lives to fight what they consider a outside enemy but don't give that same dedication to fighting the enemy within. Instead they vent their anger at the US kind of like "killing the messenger". Also a word on liberalism. Liberalism as practiced by the democratic party is an oxymoron. While on the surface every action they take looks to give us more freedom it is usually not without the loss of others. California for example, which promotes it self as a liberal state is one of the most heavily regulated and restricted areas of the nation. How does this fit into the definition of liberalism?????

 

[DJ]

Re: Iraq

dakota,<br /><br />Good point, regarding Calif.<br /><br />Who on this board has actually talked to a returning soldier?<br /><br />I have, they all have said that the Iraqi people are ecstatic about us being there. They are just scared. The Hussein brothers demise has helped, but they still fear the kingpin-Saddam.

 

[KennyKenCan]

Re: Iraq

Hey PW,<br /><br />You posted...<br /><br />

65 American kids have been killed since the end of hostilities

Who said that hostilities are over?<br /><br />The President stated only an "end to major conflict in Iraq" .<br /><br />Never once did the President or anyone in his administration state that the war was over!<br /><br />People die in war!<br /><br />I would also like to see you do your job with bullets flying over your head.<br /><br />How much do you think you would get done under those conditions.<br /><br />No one ever said that this was going to be easy or quick, except for the news media.<br /><br />Please stick to the facts!<br /><br />Then you make this statement...<br /><br />

At least the government came thru last week with orders for several hundred truckloads of plywood and several hundred loads of lumber bound for Iraq, which will keep our mill prices strong. Not sure what they plan to do with all of this lumber and plywood, but glad to see they are buying it.

I see that you are happy that Iraq is purchasing products that your business provides, which lines your pockets with money.<br /><br />You have no complaint about that!<br /><br />If the U.S. did not go to war with Iraq, your business would still be belly-aching that they can't make any money.<br /><br />And the purpose of all that lumber... REBUILDING IRAQ !

 

[KennyKenCan]

Re: Iraq

djohns...<br /><br />My freinds son has just returned from Iraq, and he states the same.<br /><br />Fear of Saddam is still high over there, but the tension was greatly relieved with the deaths of Uday and Quasay.<br /><br />The capture and/or death of Saddam is imperitive for a solution in Iraq.<br /><br />He also stated that he did not know why anyone would want to live there...there is absolutly nothing there!<br /><br />Kenny