need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

[glenn property of pam]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

great job don i like it and will link to it.

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Not done yet. Have added some more since you posted.

Still not sure it's even close to how it will be when done. It's a first draft.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

I think a Test Probe light would get you further then anything that a simple Volt meter can do in a simple 12 volt leg system.

Visual inspection of connectors and wire connectors would be a better bet.

Also .. just because you get 12.7 volts at the battery .. does not mean you have the Amps anymore. You need to Load test the battery to see if it can put out the Amps.

For a simple 12 volt system I stand by this post.

A test prob ( and possibly a ohm probe ) will diagnose your system faster.

I used to sell batteries. Right off the shelf they can be bad. Load test them first before you even Buy Them !

I can think of a few things:

1) Voltage drop across a coil.
2) Voltage drop across a ballast resistor.
3) Voltage drop from the battery to a starter to determine resistive connections or a starter consuming excess current.
4) Voltage drop from the battery to any number of destinations that go through connectors to determine a resistive connector.

This is just a few and that's just for measuring voltage drop.

Other things you need a multimeter for in a 12V DC system.

1) Measuring AC ripple of your alternator output due to bad diodes.
2) Measuring alternator output voltage.
3) Measuring coil primary and secondary resistance.
4) ....

Sorry.. I thought this was a simple 12 volt house system and not a test on the motor/supply/internal systems.

4). Test bench all Alts and Starters for diodes and stators.

You can still test them with a probe to see if there is an initial problem before you take those things to a pro. electrical alt/starter shop.

5). Coils should be tested on the bench for resistance ( hope you know how much they have ). Same with wires.

how to use a volt meter to test a battery that goes flat after 2 weeks

electricity is sometimes refered to like a liquid. a battery can be thought off as a bucket of electricity when everthing on the boat is turned off there is not meant to be any flow of electricity. the flow is so small that you will need a digitial volt meter (dvm) to read how much electricity is escaping leaving the battery empty

what do you guys think to this.....hard to keep it short and not complicated yet not insulting

First off .. again.. you need to make sure your Bucket of energy is full. That means Load testing the battery. .. For Amps.

You can have a 12 volt battery that you can touch on your tongue and hold it in your hand .. but its not gonna do any thing to start that motor of yours.

You need to follow your true battery (tested) every where it goes to and then test it. ( Im not talking about motor stators and diodes or 110 V anymore .. just simple 12 volt house systems ).

Well Glenn, I felt ambitious this morning, here is one I put together on testing voltages up to the fuse panel in a boat.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=583456

You guys look at it and make sure I don't have something wrong in the pictures and/or the text or making something clearer.

You can make a line longer by using the ---- / / --- kinda thing for your longer lines

Can you take 5 mins and show how a test light might be utilized using the same concept of a "voltmeter" please. ..

I will find a problem faster using my test probe then most will find with there Meter ..

YD.

PS. I also have a 30' aligator clip line on hand ..

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Can you take 5 mins and show how a test light might be utilized using the same concept of a "voltmeter" please. ..

I will find a problem faster using my test probe then most will find with there Meter ..

I always go for a test light first, but for some reason newbies seem to like meters and wouldn't be caught dead with test light. Then a lot of other posters start yelling "You Need a Meter Not a Test Light" not sure why, but they do. I know I can tell if a test light is bright, dim or not lit at all, but I guess that's too confusing for many.
After having said that, this "How To" is on using a meter, not a test light. It also takes a lot more than 5 minutes, especially when someone like me starts getting picky with each picture. get the wire straight into the test lead and all :facepalm: That's my fault.

I will try to figure out how to incorporate using a test light, because I know what they are worth. http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=167035

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

I understand ..

I still love my test light and my eyes too ..

YD.

 

[glenn property of pam]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

i still use a test light on cars as i have the type that punchs the wire with a needle for connecting but thats not a good idea on a system that can get wet so i dont use it on the boat i know they make other types but dvm have become cheaper than test lights so i will proberly never buy one. people like buttons and dials personally i hate new dvm as they have way to many options and have no safety built into them which is why i will never tell someone to use one to test for shore power etc. as long as someone can do a simple test that they can come back to the forum and say ....i did test #4 and i got a strange reading of XXXXX then im happy as we can then tell them where to look for the problem

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Well I brought it over from the YarCraft forum.

 

[matt167]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Checking fuses and distribution blocks, test lights are usually the first thing I go for. If it's dim, I check it to see where it's at with the DVOM, then ohm it out.. The last LED test light I bought cost $4.99. My go-to DVOM came from Harbor Freight for free on a 'gift' coupon. Same meter is usually $4 and a great deal. Auto parts stores and some box stores sell the same meter with a different badge for $15. I have a better meter, but it's still not auto ranging, so it does the same thing with a bigger screen.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

In an engineering lab, no one uses a test light. I have a extra Fluke meter that I bought specifically for my boat and it stays in there.

Most of the problems I see on the forum are voltage drop issues where someone can't figure out why they are getting 9 volts at the helm with a load turned on. Need a meter for that.

The best thing that a test light will do is to put a small load on a circuit. Many people will get fooled using a meter on a circuit that has a high resistance with no load becuase you will still read full voltage..

 

[TerryMSU]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

In an engineering lab, no one uses a test light. I have a extra Fluke meter that I bought specifically for my boat and it stays in there.

Most of the problems I see on the forum are voltage drop issues where someone can't figure out why they are getting 9 volts at the helm with a load turned on. Need a meter for that.

The best thing that a test light will do is to put a small load on a circuit. Many people will get fooled using a meter on a circuit that has a high resistance with no load becuase you will still read full voltage..

I 100% agree with all of this, but the cheapest Fluke is about $100. There are much cheaper meters out there (i.e. Harbor Freight @ approximately $3 ea.) that are suitable for a 12V applications. I keep one in the tow vehicle and one on the bench in the garage. For high voltage / high power stuff, I will still use my Fluke. BTW, one reason I picked my $100 Fluke is because it had the best continuity beeper function at the price point.

TerryMSU

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Spoken like true Electrical and Electronic engineers. :facepalm:
Now, lay on your back on wet carpet trying to get under the dash of a 17' bow rider and find out why some lights aren't working. You can just barely get your head under there, maybe one hand, so trying to use two test leads and reading a meter is all but impossible. Clip on the test light ground, then with one hand an one eye you can probe different spots and watch the bulb.
On boats, .05 volt loss doesn't mean a hill if beans like it does in electronics. In boats, 5 or 6 volt loss is noticeable and a problem, your milli and micro volts wouldn't even be noticed.

In boats a marine tech will do something like this to find out why a light is out or real dim.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Don, I see your point about the test light. I use ground clips for my meter so at least I don't need a third hand.

 

[glenn property of pam]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

if you have a fuse blowing the test light can be put in place of a fuse if you have the probe type then you can chase the short until the light goes out and its easier than keep having to go backwards and forwards to check the meter i had a light bulb made up that used that way so i can go wiggle wires looking for a short.

bruce has a good point with "The best thing that a test light will do is to put a small load on a circuit. Many people will get fooled using a meter on a circuit that has a high resistance with no load because you will still read full voltage.. " i have proberly $12k in meters and a 11 dollar wiggy as none of my other meters can add a load and as more things become solid state im sure the forum will be full of questions on why the meter reads 12.5v yet it wont lamp a bulb

 

[TerryMSU]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Spoken like true Electrical and Electronic engineers. :facepalm:
Now, lay on your back on wet carpet trying to get under the dash of a 17' bow rider and find out why some lights aren't working. You can just barely get your head under there, maybe one hand, so trying to use two test leads and reading a meter is all but impossible. Clip on the test light ground, then with one hand an one eye you can probe different spots and watch the bulb.
On boats, .05 volt loss doesn't mean a hill if beans like it does in electronics. In boats, 5 or 6 volt loss is noticeable and a problem, your milli and micro volts wouldn't even be noticed.

In boats a marine tech will do something like this to find out why a light is out or real dim.

View attachment 173107

Don:

Even in a boat both devices have legitimate uses, and mis-uses. I have both in my tool set, although I more often go to the DMM. Remember the line about "the man whose only tool is a hammer...". You do need to know which tool you should use for any given situation.

I worked for years as an electronic tech, before I went back to school to get my engineering degree. I remember when a digital multimeter was a real luxury, even in industry. I even still have a few analog meters around. Although I am an engineer, I know how to be a qualified technician.

BTW, if I were looking for a bad ground, I would tie the clip end of the test probe to the battery positive terminal and probe the ground connections You should get a much stronger light variation that way.

One other comment. Your nice schematic assumes that we have a nice neat schematic of the wiring system in our boat. Mine is no near that clean and organized. It is 22 years old and has had several wiring "repairs" long before I bought it. The only connections on my boat that I know I can trust, and know where and how they are routed, are those that I made (in person) directly to the battery.

TerryMSU

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

I know about using the test light to check grounds, I just didn't post that picture too.



I'm just saying a test light is a valid tool on a boat, not just a DMM or even an analog meter (I still have a couple of those too, they work great on potentiometers).
Sometimes you just can't even see a meter, but you can see a light.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Sorry.. I did not mean to derail the thread with the whole "test light thing".

I just thought it would be more helpful in diagnostic terms of a 12 volt simple system.

Was I wrong about "Not needing a DMM for a simple 12 volt system" .. yes.

Was I wrong about using a "Test light" for quick and easy diagnostic or even find a problem tool.. NO.

It was just a point that a cheap test light And a cheap conductivity tester will locate your problems faster then a DMM in most cases in a simple 12 volt system.

I have 2 20' alligator clip leads ( one for trailers and small boats .. and an extra one for larger boats ).

Again..sorry for the sidestep on the thread ..

YD.

PS. Don .. I have a test light with a 90 degree DIY bent end for them "hard to get and wet 17 foot" console panels .. works real good .. but I think I will make it more to a 60 deg.

 

[glenn property of pam]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

you are not de-railing the tread if anything you are adding to it yd. to be honest we need more people to pitch in especially the ones who do not work on electrical every day to see if they understand what we are trying to say. until this thread gets on a banned subject its all good info and ideas

 

[Don S]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

Just curious Glenn, have you looked at the new sticky at the top of this forum? I put it up yesterday morning.

 

[KX6D]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

CLICK HERE, then scroll down and look at the related items.

So why not make a sticky with this one post? I love lmgtfy btw! I use it all the time!

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: need a sticky/link on how to use a basic volt meter

i have proberly $12k in meters and a 11 dollar wiggy as none of my other meters can add a load and as more things become solid state im sure the forum will be full of questions on why the meter reads 12.5v yet it wont lamp a bulb

Holy crap !! 12 thousand in meters ? Is this a typo or real..

Cause if its real then I dont see anyone will be able to help you help us on the subject

you are not de-railing the tread if anything you are adding to it yd. to be honest we need more people to pitch in especially the ones who do not work on electrical every day to see if they understand what we are trying to say. until this thread gets on a banned subject its all good info and ideas

Dont see why this thread would get Locked up unless it runs into an endless debate.

I just wanted to put my pennies in the bubble gum machine.

YD.