93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Ok,..I am looking to purchase glassing materials. I know I will be using 1708....which I believe is 17ounce cloth....and 8ounce CSM
Is that chopped strand mat? Also I believe it is cabasil (sp) and others......guess I need to go back and read those older posts and write it down this time. Also I am looking for information on gel coat for the inside of the boat.....or its equivalent as I will not be putting carpet back on the floor. I do know about UScomposits .....I just didn't want to call them and sound ignorant! Lol

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Ok guys...got my old motor sold sat. Morning and I am ready to order materials...just trying to figure out how much of what to order.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Search through my FireFlite thread, PMC re-posted a suggested starting point for runabout rebuilds. It was a basic list for 15-16 footers. Full gut, stringers & transom work. Since you have more bulkheads (mine = none), more built ins, (mine = none) and longer boat, up the quantities by at least 25-30%. You can also get linear feet of glass based on where you'll use it, and the width of the pieces & do the math long hand. :facepalm: but no thanks.....

Here's a little overview of glass & resin info.... W/ some estimates of how much resin is required to wet out 1708 & CSM. It's a penny booklet, but no charge download.

Here's a under decking permenant aluminum gas tank install reference as well.....

Great to hear your ordering glassing supplies. NICE! Have a great week,

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Well....I called that company and after 1min and 43 sec the guy said "I really don't have that much time to be on the phone" I said ok...and hung up. I called uscomposites and that guy spent almost 30 mins on the phone with me. Only thing the uscomp guy said was not to bed stringers with PB. He said use Epoxy Something called fast cure 110 I believe. Sorry left my notes at the office. Also...because I am wanting to gelcoat the deck with no carpet...he said use 1708 instead for a smoother finish. If that is true do I even need any CSM? Can I just do all my tabbing etc for stringers, bulks, and transom?

 

[rickryder]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

CSM for the bottom of the deck.....

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Sorry, if you were referring to the FGSite I linked, I was not suggesting that you use them for glassing supplies, just the info to help calc resin consumption.....

USComp generally kills the competition in both service & price..... I found 1 other place that has a very slight price advantage on resin, but they only really beat USComp on the HazMat & shipping charges. And to a different zip, the savings may be less, or more. But it's enough for me to get the resin & hardener from them, all else will be USComp.

Whoever you get your supplies from, try & give them a business address instead of a residential address & if there is a loading dock at trailer height, make sure to let them know, those will get you a better shipping rate too.

The glassing schedule & products generally outlined @the forums are well rooted in practical applications. The Fast Cure 110 epoxy XYZ may also do the job for bedding stringers, but if epoxy based, will probably be more expensive then a similar volume of either PB or PL.

If you do use it & are happy w/ the price, ease of use, and performance bedding your stringers, make sure you post the correct product name & costs. More info & options are good. PB lets you use supplies that you'd also need for other things. If you run short, easy to make more, & if you don't mix & use all that you buy to bed the stringers, you can use those materials for something else on your rebuild...

Glad the guy @USComp was helpful & took some time to help w/ your Q&A's...

 

[rickryder]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Fiberglass Information, and How much resin do I need?
Please remember several things: These are estimates not hard and fast rules. If you are laminating over wood, the raw wood will soak up some resin, which is good, but you will use more resin on the first layer. Thin resin goes farther than thick resin.
Chopped strand mat:
The general rule for chopped stand mat is 1.5 to two times the weight in resin to the weight of mat.
For 1.5 ounce chopped strand mat you will need 3 to 4 ounces per SQUARE FOOT.
For 2.0 ounce chopped strand mat you will need 4 to 5 ounces per SQUARE FOOT.
There are about 150 ounces or resin by weight per gallon. Example: 10 square yards of chopped strand mat is 90 square feet. 90 x 4 = 360 oz. 360 oz of mat divided by 150 oz per gallon gives you 2.4 gallons.
Material to approximate gallons of resin used.
1.5 OZ MAT = 1 gallon covers 4.2 square yds
2.0 OZ MAT = 1 gallon covers 3.4 square yds
Here is a helpful table for cloth:
There are about 150 ounces per gallon by weight
1.5 ounce cloth (cloth not chopped mat)….1 gallon wets out 40 square yards
2.5 ounce cloth….1 gallon wets out 25 square yards
4 ounce cloth……1 gallon wets out 15 square yards
6 ounce cloth……1 gallon wets out 10 square yards
10 ounce cloth…..1 gallon wets out 6.5 square yards
18 ounce woven roving …1 gallon wets out 4.5 square yards
24 ounce woven roving …1 gallon wets out 3.5 square yards.
Biaxial mat 1708.………….. 1 gallon wets out 4 square yards

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Thanks so much for all the info....I really would like to use PL for my stringers and transom to the hull of the boat. I did some research and you cannot put polyester resin anywhere there is expoxy. So how could one bed their stringers in epoxy and then tab with polyester resin. With think on this more and hopefully make a decision in the next couple of days.....still A LOT of grinding to do!

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Ok...new question. What is the correct wood type to use for stringers and transom. I have 4 stringers two where 12ft and not plywood and the other two are less than 89 ft and were originally plywood....transom was also 3.....3/4inch pieces of plywood.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Exterior grade, Aruacoco (sp?), MDO, or any exterior rated, void-free core, made w/ waterproof glue plywood.... Underlayment, Plytanium, etc , may or may not meet those specs.

Check GT1000000's thread for how he made extra long stringers by gluing 2 3/8" sheets together w/ staggered joints

I'd probably use ply for all the stringers, just glue up (TiteBond 3 is water proof when dry, Gorilla Glue & similar are super strong too) whatever you need to get the thickness of the original stringers out of 3/8", 1/2", 5/8", &/or 3/4" sheets. Even 'just' 20 yrs ago when your boat was built, dimensional lumber (1X6~2X12, whatever) was of a better quality then you'd find at most home improvement & lumber yards today. Straighter, tighter grain, less crown (bow) and less twist.

Your transom was originally 2 layers of glass & 2.25+" of plywood? Maybe the upper portion of the transom directly under the cap, wasn't that thick... But maybe.... I'd be sure to put it back the same, else the cap won't fit, or won't fully support the O/B.

Have a great week

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

LOL!! I was just reading my post and realizing...there will be no more forum updates from my "smart" phone! Man, it put in words and numbers I didnt even type! I thought wow...less than 89ft stringers...on an 18ft boat huh? LOL and it put "where" for were! Ok...thanks for all the info. I wonder if those wood types can be purchased from lowes...maybe special order? Will check tomorrow.

Also....has anyone ever ordered from Fasco Epoxies? was doing some research on the Fasco 110 adhesive sold by uscomposites and found I can order directly from Fasco. Although I will probably go with bedding the stringers in PL. and making my own PB instead of the Fasco 110.... they did have a lot of other products similar to uscomposites. Will check pricing, shipping and Hazard fees tomorrow just to see.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Yeah, Tap-a-Talk is looking good for my 'Droid... Reading post is a PITA & posting, forget about it...PM's are even worse to read & reply is not an option...

Have a good week... Fasco, hmmm I've heard of that, maybe foundation epoxy for bolts.....

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Your transom was originally 2 layers of glass & 2.25+" of plywood? Maybe the upper portion of the transom directly under the cap, wasn't that thick... But maybe.... I'd be sure to put it back the same, else the cap won't fit, or won't fully support the O/B.

I had posted in my video about a substance used between the transom and cap of the boat that looked like bondo...I picked a piece up off the floor this evening while cleaning up and noticed it had fiberglass strands in it, and it smelled a lot like fiberglass. I know this is down the road, but after reading that part of your post I decided to mention it to try and determine what it was.

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

ok...last question for tonight....poop! It is already morning! My plan is to install the transom, cut and bed stringers and bulkheads.....fillet and tab them..set the top cap back on, then cut deck and install and tab around sides of deck....make all my marks for under cap pieces like under steering wheel etc....then remove cap...build all glassing as necessary for the above then sitting cap back on for final installation. Now, I realize that is not mentioning every step but you get the idea. My hull seems to not move at all when standing in or near the keel. Only when I step toward the side. I feel like keeping all this in mind while cutting, bedding, fillers, ad tabbing my stringers will allow for the cap to not have to be installed while doing this. Just wanted some opinions.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Measure measure measure & record..... Run nylon cinch straps around the hull to make sure it doesn't move outward & stays put. That should keep it from spreading out....

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Ok....starting the actual grinding today after finally getting all the wood out of the front. You know when you read all the posts that talk about a lot of grinding ....that sure wasn't an April fools joke! Lol there is A LOT of grinding!!!! I believe I will get me a case of 24 grit sanding disks! Lol so I just suit up and put in the headphones and grind my troubles away.

 

[riptorn]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Are you sure it wasn't a 24 of beer? Lol. Need something to wash down what got through.
Fun wow. I still remember after 37 years. lol.
geter done
Oh ya, two cold showers !

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Now thats some good advice! The beer I mean! Lol

 

[93bayliner1800]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

Ok..guys have a transom replacement question. Probably have to watch the video to understand this one.

 

[rickryder]

Re: 93 Bayliner 1800 Capri Outboard Restoration Project

I would grind the loose csm out.... clean up the transom skin to good glass where you need to..... prep surface (wash down with acetone)

Then in the lowest spots start to build it back up with strips of csm in layers. Once its all built up you can grind down any high spots....PB the skin and install transom wood... If it were me I would make a full transom across the back from gunwale to gunwale....PB the corners fillet and wrap the glass around 6" then 8" onto the gunwales.