Couldn't have said it better

spike440

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Apr 11, 2003
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Re: Couldn't have said it better

If a law abiding person owns a legal, pemitted, full auto AK47, and a thug, loser, lowlife steals a single shot 12 guage, the shotgun is the most dangerous. It doesn't matter how many rounds, or firing capabilities, it is who holds the weopon.<br /><br />I've seen that list attributed to Ted Nugent.
 

plywoody

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Aug 11, 2002
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Re: Couldn't have said it better

Those are not my statistics. I have no idea whether they have any validity or not.<br /><br />The point is that if there is a disproportionate number of crimes being committed by a particular ethnic group in a particular location, chances are there is some sort of reason for it. They are not born as criminals (for the most part, at least) they learn to be criminals. Fix the problem, whether it be home environment or school or whatever. It is cheaper than the cost of the crimes, and the costs of building prisons to house prisoners.<br /><br />At least attempt to fix the problem as we lock up the perpetrators. It simply makes common, and economic, not to mention sociological, sense.<br /><br />As far as the golf club goes, your analogy completely loses me. It makes no sense whatsoever. That's the problem with arguing with you conservative types. You change the data to fit your facts, such as they are. What reference was there in anything I said to owning one gun, or a hundred guns, not to mention one or many golf clubs?<br /><br />Just curious. Do you think it your right to head down to a North Carolina gun shop, for example, buy 40 or 50 handguns, and take them up to New York City and sell them on the street to anyone that has the money to pay for them?
 

roscoe

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Oct 30, 2002
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21,786
Re: Couldn't have said it better

No, because there are laws against that. The people selling guns on the streets of NY are already breaking the law. Why don't you go tell them to stop.<br />-----------------------------------<br />So if 70% of population and arrests are black, how is that an indication that something is wrong?<br /><br />Would it make you FEEL better if 70% of population was black, but only 2% of the arrested were black?<br /><br />I thought that color didn't matter. So why should it even be a factor in a study or statistic?
 

BlackSmoke

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Jun 11, 2002
Messages
116
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Typical right-wing propoganda to stir up the fear that drives racism and nationalism in this country. And, a typical ploy of right-wing conservatives to attach a celebrity's name who didn't even make the remarks. I can sum that post up in one sentence. "I'm an ignorant, close minded racist, and if you don't agree with me, I'll kick your a$$." How embarassing.
 

NathanY

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Mar 16, 2002
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2,408
Re: Couldn't have said it better

You know what, I cant stand people like you Plywoody. <br /><br />Who the f*ck are you to tell me what gun I can and cant own? If I want to own 10 fully automatic AK-47's with 200 round clips, Then that is my right. It is people like you and your Dumb Ass president Clinton that are trying to take that away from me, and in the process you make it easier for criminals to get these guns.<br /><br />As far as homo's go, I dont give a flying flip what they are or who they are. But why do they need to advertise it? If they would learn to keep thier mouths shut, there would be no disrimination against them, because no one would know. I dont drive around or march in a parade saying I LOVE P*SSY do I, and the first time something like this happend all the F*Gs would be out in full force to sue or what ever.<br /><br />As far as employers hiring people, they should be able to hire who they want, but no they cant, they have to hire who the government tells them to. You have to hire the unqualified minority, instead of the qualified white guy. I HAVE BEEN A VICTIM OF THIS, SO DONT GIVE ME YOUR CRAP ABOUT IT DOESNT HAPPEN. <br /><br />LIBERAL ARE TRYING TO RUIN THIS COUNTRY, THANK GOD WE HAVE CONTROL OF THE HOUSE AND SENATE.
 

plywoody

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Messages
685
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Your post is simply a classic, Nathan.<br /><br />I rest my case.
 

BlackSmoke

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jun 11, 2002
Messages
116
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Cracks me up that when you question the right-wing conservative agenda, the next thing you hear is an attack against Bill and Hillary Clinton. By the way, Nathan, Bill's no longer president. Liberals are ruining this country??? Give me a break!
 

Cobotr

Seaman
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Mar 26, 2003
Messages
69
Re: Couldn't have said it better

A simple question was asked of Plywoody of which I would still be interested in his explanation. Afterall he rewrote the original to HIS interpretation. You're reply was something about disproportionate numbers. That's not what the original or you're restatemant says statistically. 70% resulting in 70% IS proportional whether you're talking about bananas, oranges, or apples.<br /><br />How is it that it can now be twisted into name calling and labeling? Take a deep breath. You don't know me, and I doubt you ever will. But a simple answer to a simple question shouldn't create such hatred. Just an educated answer.
 

NathanY

Commander
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Mar 16, 2002
Messages
2,408
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Yes that is what I said YOU LIBERALS ARE RUINING THIS COUNTRY! ALL YOU WANT IS TO TAKE THE RIGHTS AWAY FROM PEOPLE, AND MAKE GOVERNMENT BIGGER. <br /><br />AS FAR AS BILL CLINTON GOES, I KNOW THAT HE IS NOT PRESIDENT, BUT HE STILL RUNS THE DNC AND YOU KNOW IT. SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL SAY HE STILL HAS THE POWER. <br /><br />AND AS FAR AS HITLER-Y CLINTON GOES, IM GLAD SHE IS IN NEW YORK, AT LEAST SHE CANT SCREW ANYMORE ARKANSANS OUT OF ANYMORE MONEY OR LAND. SHE SHOULD HAVE WENT TO JAIL FOR THAT, IT IS A VERY BAD THING SHE DID TO PEOPLE DOWN HERE.<br /><br />I GOT IT, PLYWOODY AND BLACK SMOKE, LETS TAKE ALL THE MONEY THAT PEOPLE MAKE FROM THEM, AND PUT IT IN GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS THAT DONT WORK, AND TAKE ALL THE RIGHTS AWAY FROM PEOPLE, AND MAKE THIS A SOCIALIST SOCIETY, I BET ALL YOU LIBERALS WOULD LIKE THAT.<br /><br />AND ANOTHER THING, WHY ARE YOU LIBERALS SO AGAINST THESE TAX CUTS? YOU SAY THEY ARE FOR THE RICH? THAT IS BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ONES PAYING ALL THE TAXES, HOW ARE YOU GONNA CUT TAXES FOR PEOPLE THAT DONT PAY TAXES? HOW YOU GONNA CUT MY TAXES? I HAVE NEVER PAID TAXES, I GET ALL MY MONEY BACK EVERY YEAR? THE TOP 25% OF WAGE EARNERS PAY 75% OF ALL THE TAXES. SO WHY SHOULDNT THEY GET THEIR MONEY BACK?
 

plywoody

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Messages
685
Re: Couldn't have said it better

You are right. Those statistics cited in the original are indeed proportional. I have no idea what they were trying to prove, and I reacted to what those kinds of statistics traditionally try to prove.<br /><br />And I have no idea why some get so irrational about this subject. I suspect it is because they lack rational arguments, which the evidence suggests is the case.<br /><br />As far as tax cuts to the wealthy, I am afraid it is too difficult to give a complete economic theory education in a paragraph or two, but I will give it a try anyway.<br /><br />The government needs a certain amount of money to operate. If it is out of balance, in deficit, as it is now, there are only two things to do. One is to spend less, but that is hardly likely with the war and all the other things going on.<br /><br />The other is to raise more money. This is the tricky part. You can simply raise taxes accross the board, but that gives people less to spend on other things, and the economy slows down even more, and you end up bringing in less than you expected it would, and still have the same problem. Except the economy has slowed.<br /><br />Or you can cut taxes in the hopes it stimulates activity, and has the result of bringing in more money, as opposed to less. That is the theory of this tax cut, or so it is claimed.<br /><br />The problem comes when it is targeted at the very wealthy, when the problem in the country is that we have overcapacity everywhere. These wealthy people are not going to take the money and invest in new capacity when we already have too much. With interest rates so cheap, they would be borrowing money and investing it, if there was a reasonable return to be made.<br /><br />And the wealthy people are already spending everything they want to spend anyway, and a big tax cut for them will do nothing to stimulate the economy, and just generate more deficits.<br /><br />We need more consumption in this country, and in that light, the people in the middle are more likely to spend extra money from a tax cut that they recieve, which causes some of the capacity to be put back to work, and more people employed and paying taxes, and the deficits decrease. (BTW this is precisely the strategy that your hated Clinton used, and it worked perfectly for quite a while, until it was abandoned by this president)<br /><br />Sadly, the wealthy people tend to be the ones that make the big republican campaign contributions, and they seem to get what they want under this administration.<br /><br />I guess when the economy gets even worse, as it surely will, they can always continue to blame it on the Clintons, as it appears they still have lots of willing listeners to that theory, however much it is that it makes no sense.
 

roscoe

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Re: Couldn't have said it better

Sadly, the wealthy people tend to be the ones that make the big republican campaign contributions, and they seem to get what they want under this administration.<br />
Well, you don't expect the poor people to make big contributions, do you? Ah yes, I guess you do, as per several of the proposed campaign finance reform bills.<br /><br />And don't work off the assumption that all wealthy people, or business owners are republicans. There are millions of wealthy democrats and business owners. And they also grease the palms of their elected officials, whether they be rep or dem, whoever can make their life more lucrative.
 

plywoody

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Re: Couldn't have said it better

Absolutely true. There are indeed wealthy democrats that contribute, and want payback. No question. In either case, it is shortsighted, in my opinion.<br /><br />Frankly it is kind of ironic that wealthy people generally benefit more from a strong economy than they do from any sort of preferred tax break, except perhaps for the kids of wealthy people who will benefit from the repeal of the estate tax.<br /><br />I certainly did not see any wealthy people hitting the food banks during the Clinton years, when he actually raised taxes a little on the very wealthy. When the economy is booming under full capacity utilization, the wealthy tend to do better. Which is ok with me, I am all for it.<br />Paying a slightly higher rate on a much higher income still leaves more at the end of the day.
 

BlackSmoke

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Jun 11, 2002
Messages
116
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Nathan, If you don't pay taxes, why do you care? You get all the benefits of a tax funded society, and you're protected by the mightiest armed forces in the world, and you don't pay a cent for it.<br />As far as wanting to "take the rights away from people", I believe it's Dubya and his sidekick Ashcroft you ought to be concerned about. They've done more in the last two years to take your rights away than any liberal ever has.
 

dkondelik

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Sep 10, 2002
Messages
643
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Ply,<br /><br />per your reply re. my post.<br />Of course you don't get it. I'd have been shocked if you had.<br /><br />NEXT: DEFINE RICH. <br />(I'll bet that you "don't get" this too)<br /><br />The naiveté of the left never ceases to amaze me.<br />Here’s another chance for you to stand on your soapbox.<br />How about an example of “where” your socialist utopianism has worked?<br />(I’m leaving a lot of latitude for your response because it’ll be fun. It is expected that as you typically do, you’ll respond with an answer to a question that wasn’t asked).
 

plywoody

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Re: Couldn't have said it better

Klondike,<br /><br />I am not going to debate labels and ideologies with you. Sorry. It is a waste of time.<br />Where in anything I said is any reference to social utopianism? Whatever that is.<br />You want to debate specifics, fine.<br />And defining what "rich" means is also fruitless and meaningless. Specific economic policy and tax policy and its effects are important. Labels are not.<br />Sorry to have to make you actually think about something, rather than to spout your right wing cliches and propoganda that you are so good at. I know how it must hurt.
 

dkondelik

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Messages
643
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Ply,<br /><br />Sorry to confuse you again. I just reread some of above. I meant to ask was -<br /><br />DEFINE WEALTHY......<br /><br />again, sorry for the confusion
 

plywoody

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Aug 11, 2002
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Re: Couldn't have said it better

Just like pornography, you'd know it if you saw it.<br />What's it have to do with economic policy anyway?
 

NathanY

Commander
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Mar 16, 2002
Messages
2,408
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Not even the strongest Army in the world can stop a Liberal with an agenda.<br /><br />Why do I care? Just because Im poor, the rest of my family is not. I dont ask them for any money, just like I dont ask the government for any money or hand outs. But I hate to see my father, who is a heavy equipment mechanic, bust his ass 14hrs a day, have 40% of his paycheck stolen from him. You would not last 1 day working with him. I didnt, and I am younger and much stronger than he. I think he deserves better.<br /><br />Just out of curiosity, where you Black Smoke, or Plywoody ever in the military?
 

plywoody

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Aug 11, 2002
Messages
685
Re: Couldn't have said it better

Nope. Never in the military. A proud Viet Nam era draft dodger. Completely legally, of course.
 

ebbtide176

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Jan 22, 2002
Messages
2,289
Re: Couldn't have said it better

plywoody <br />Captain <br />Member # 14783 <br /><br />Nope. Never in the military. A proud Viet Nam era draft dodger. Completely legally, of course.
ah PW, finally it has come to rest - you are a draft dodger. too **** bad. so i guess you believe its ok to live here as long as the government is passing laws and doing things that go in your favor...<br /><br />i've got to say, although i'm sure you're a legend in your own mind, you continually cause heated arguments here, and you have become 1 step above the level of a spammer. you can pretend to be "debating", but it is easily apparent that you really spend more time pushing your beliefs, with very little acknowledgment of others opinions. <br /><br />if you had given positive criticism and tried to be more helpful to others, i would not hold you in such contempt.<br /><br />if, in your mind, you feel that this is a typical response of some kind, then you really need to take a moment of pause. be done with your diatribe, please! can you not simply put a reply that follows the flow of topics here, without trying to be so whiney? if not, then please, please, please, just start your own topics. it has reached a point here, that your flames are affecting congruity of the regulars. <br /><br />just be nice or make up new topics to critique/debate your flameworthy issues... everyone gets in a venting mode sometimes, but jeez man, gimme a break.<br /><br />IMHO
 
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