First engine rebuild

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

He said hell check for cracks on the block. I dunno about aligning the mains. Ill ask him tom cause I have to bring something else down there.

I have to either order, or bring down there, camshaft bearings and brass freeze plugs tomorrow. I should have just ordered them while I was there.
 

RogersJetboat454

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2,964
Re: First engine rebuild

He said hell check for cracks on the block. I dunno about aligning the mains. Ill ask him tom cause I have to bring something else down there.

I have to either order, or bring down there, camshaft bearings and brass freeze plugs tomorrow. I should have just ordered them while I was there.

Good one on the crack check. Wouldn't want to drop the cash on something that has a stress crack that could get worse.

He may not have to align bore the mains, he should at least check them first. If the block has shifted over time the mains may be out of alignment which could wear out your main bearings in short order if left uncorrected.
 

Aloysius

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Re: First engine rebuild

The alignment of the mains is checked by spinning the crank with the bearings in place. It's also checked by inspecting the main bearings during disassembly. If the bearings look ok, and the crank spins freely, forget the main alignment.
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

I just left the shop. I was going there to order/buy the cam bearings and freeze plugs. When i got there they said he already had it all done.

Maybe I was confused yesterday but they got/had the parts and just did it.

So total was $325

They swapped for a reconditioned crank. Mine was already ground 20 and needed it again. Plus my cranks bolt threads were destroyed where the crank pulley bolt goes.

Finish disassembling the block
Checked block for cracks
Honed block
Cleaned/boiled block
Checked main alignment
Checked all rods and pistons.
Reconditioned 3 pistons
Installed freeze plugs (parts included)
Installed cam bearings (parts included)
removed timing gear from crank


It looks like a brand new block now. No more paint and it's all clean.

Gonna put a parts list together and order some stuff.

He said the rings are a standard 4" bore. And the rod bearings and main bearings are gonna be 20 also.
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

I just got the block back on the stand and I had to open the bag to bolt it on. I can put the bag back on but shouldnt I oil all of the new bare metal on the block so it doesnt rust?

Should I use a light coat of assembly lube? I have a can of it.


I dont think I can post links to them but should I get cast rings, or moly rings? The moly rings made by Federal Mogul are only $38 vs cast is $30.

Is Federal Mogul a good brand or junk?


And on the rod and main bearings. I see ones without the chamfered oil holes and ones with.

I should get the ones with the oil hole right? Thats the kind that came out of it.



Thanks
 

CobiaXL

Banned
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Mar 8, 2010
Messages
353
Re: First engine rebuild

I would check rpmmachine dot com out for all your parts,can't beat there deals or shipping...I've used them and not 1 complaint ever.Good coat of WD-40 would get the job done but not necessary.No need for moly but cant hurt..
 

RogersJetboat454

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2,964
Re: First engine rebuild

I just got the block back on the stand and I had to open the bag to bolt it on. I can put the bag back on but shouldnt I oil all of the new bare metal on the block so it doesnt rust?

Should I use a light coat of assembly lube? I have a can of it.


I dont think I can post links to them but should I get cast rings, or moly rings? The moly rings made by Federal Mogul are only $38 vs cast is $30.

Is Federal Mogul a good brand or junk?


And on the rod and main bearings. I see ones without the chamfered oil holes and ones with.

I should get the ones with the oil hole right? Thats the kind that came out of it.



Thanks

Did the machine shop advise you to clean the engine after you got it back? Since it sounds like they did just a simple hone job, they may have cleaned it up for you. In the case of the engine I did, I had them bore .030 and deck the block. They told me to wash it down with hot soapy water, then rinse with hot water.

Instead of oiling the block down, making it a big PITA to paint it later on, I would go out and get some engine paint and paint her up. The block may flash rust a little bit, but during this time of year when the humidity is relatively low, you have a while before this happens. Just make sure you mask off the parts of the engine that you don't want paint in (lifter valley, cylinders/deck, timing chain area, crank case, fuel pump mounting pad).


Federal Mogul is fine. They make good standard replacement parts. I would use the Molly rings, since they usually break in and seat allot better than plain iron rings. When its time to install the rings, they need to be installed so the openings face a certain way. If you line all the openings to the rings up, or just throw them on with out paying attention, your new engine may suffer from excessive blow-by. This would be a good time to have one of the many books on rebuilding a SBC, most of which have the diagram of how to orient the rings openings to minimize blow-by.

The bearings with the chamfered oil holes are fine. I would use a set of Clevite 77 bearings. They make a good product, and pretty much the industry standard for replacement bearings.

While your shopping, make sure you pick up some assembly lube. Some people cheat and just use heavy weight oil, or white lithium paste. I prefer a good assembly lube that you know will stick to the parts, even if the engine sits for a period after the rebuild. Lithium paste isn't really meant to be an assembly lube, and it can make the oil hard to "read" (analyze during break in).

Also since you will most likely be using flat tappet lifters, make sure you pick up some zinc additive to add to the oil. Modern oils are all but devoid of zinc, since it will foul catalytic converters over time. Old school flat tappet lifters need the zinc to help protect them from galling during break in. You should be able to find zinc oil additive made by most major aftermarket cam manufacturers (comp cams, crane, etc).

One final question; Did the machine shop install ALL the oil galley plugs? There are 3 in the front above the first cam bearing, and three threaded pipe plugs in the back above the rear cam bearings cover. There is also a hidden one under the rear main cap. here is a tech article by CHP describing their installation http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/te...ics/index.html
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

About oiling it I was asking about the cylinder bores and other "bare" metal areas.

I put some assembly lube on the bores and other bare spots I saw.

No the shop did not tell me to clean the block. It looks spotless to me except for where I put assembly lube now.
 

RogersJetboat454

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Re: First engine rebuild

About oiling it I was asking about the cylinder bores and other "bare" metal areas.

I put some assembly lube on the bores and other bare spots I saw.

No the shop did not tell me to clean the block. It looks spotless to me except for where I put assembly lube now.

The assembly lube should work fine to protect the machined surfaces. Just make sure to clean it off the deck before you put the head gasket on, and bolt down the heads.

It may look spotless to you, but you can't see in microns either. Residue from the honing stones, and particles of iron removed during the honing can hide on you. Might be worth a call to the machine shop to see if the block was cleaned after they were finished with the machining work.
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

Thanks for all of the help and advice.


I will call and ask them about the cleaning. Im gonna call anyways and ask about the oil galley plugs.


My plan right now (always changing right now) is to use the cam that came out of the engine as it still looks good. The engine did run perfect besides the knocking which I now know why it was knocking.

But Im gonna reuse the cam, pushrods, and lifters?. Im gonna order piston rings, main bearings, and rod bearings. Then Im gonna put the bottom end together and go from there.

The heads are still sitting here and as I didnt have any problems with them before I was gonna throw them on after Im done with the bottom end and adjust all of the rockers,valves.

So Im gonna order this stuff now and then after I get it together order the gaskets.
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

Is there anything else I need to put the bottom end together? dont I need the rear seal?
 

Fishermark

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Re: First engine rebuild

Is there anything else I need to put the bottom end together? dont I need the rear seal?

The seal will come with your gasket set. I personally like FelPro.

You might also ask the machine shop about the rings. I believe they are honed differently for different types of ring material. Ask what they did and what they recommend.
 

RogersJetboat454

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Re: First engine rebuild

Thanks for all of the help and advice.


I will call and ask them about the cleaning. Im gonna call anyways and ask about the oil galley plugs.


My plan right now (always changing right now) is to use the cam that came out of the engine as it still looks good. The engine did run perfect besides the knocking which I now know why it was knocking.

But Im gonna reuse the cam, pushrods, and lifters?. Im gonna order piston rings, main bearings, and rod bearings. Then Im gonna put the bottom end together and go from there.

The heads are still sitting here and as I didnt have any problems with them before I was gonna throw them on after Im done with the bottom end and adjust all of the rockers,valves.

So Im gonna order this stuff now and then after I get it together order the gaskets.

Well, you can reuse the cam, push rods and lifters, but I would scrutinize the parts. Since you have had an issue with oil pressure in this engine, there could be a good possibility that damage has happened to the cam and lifters (rounded lobes, concave tappets,scored bearing journals). Cam & lifter sets are cheap, so aren't push rods. If you want to reuse your push rods check each one over. Spin each one on a known flat surface, and make sure they don't wobble. Then clean them up really good, and make sure the oil passages are clean.

As far as the heads are concerned, if it were my engine they would be going to the machine shop too.

You have to keep in mind, you had a burn between what looks like cylinders 3 & 5, which could indicate a warped head.

I would want them cleaned, crack checked, checked for squareness, check the valve guides, 3 angle valve job, check for tired valve springs, and install new valve seals.

Or, you could shop for some new/reman Vortec heads that will give you a nice little bump in power, and probably cost you a little more if not the same as getting your old heads worked over. If you did go the Vortec route, you would need a matching marine grade intake, self aligning rockers, and new valve covers if you engine doesn't have center bolt valve covers.

Its ultimately your decision. You spent some decent cake and time on the bottom end, it would be nice to know you have an equally competent set of heads on top to match your efforts.
 

proshadetree

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Re: First engine rebuild

I would not reuse lifters unless you knew exactly which bore they came from. They wear mate to the cam. When cleaning your bore use white paper towels keep cleaning until they come out white. Cleanliness is very important when building an engine. Do you have a torque wrench?
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

Yea I have a couple torque wrenches. And I already have plastigauge.

The litters looked brand new to me but what do I know? I'll get new ones if it's better to do so.
 

RogersJetboat454

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Re: First engine rebuild

Ditto on reusing the lifters if you didn't keep track of what bores they came out of.

If your not going to do a cam kit, then at least make sure you spring for decent lifters. Half of the problem that people are having with lifters killing cams is the lack of zinc in the oil, the other half is using junk lifters.
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

So i ordered the Main bearings, rod bearings, and piston rings.

The guy at the shop said they did install all of the oil galley plugs, and I went and checked and they're there.

I guess when I get the parts I ordered I will install the pistons and the crank.

In the meantime Im gonna check the push rods, and get my order for the gaskets and lifters going.
 

926bill

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Oct 17, 2010
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Re: First engine rebuild

Have the heads looked at. Leaky valve guides can be a problem as well as worn out springs. Any good machine shop can do this and your shops prices seem very reasonable. Did you mark which bore the lifters came out of? If not don't reuse, they are broke into specific lobes on the cam. They spin when running and if they go in the wrong lifter bore they might not spin right and wipe out the cam. I'd get new lifters and a liberal amount of molly lube on the cam and face of the lifters. Check the old lifters, there should be acircle on each one, which is the wear mark that shows they were spinning in the lifter bores. Good luck on your project.
BC
 

fat fanny

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Re: First engine rebuild

I would have to agree witht he above. You have been going the distance the correct way so far and to not at least have the heads gone over would seem to be a bad decission whay leave anything to chance @ this point even if it mans waiting a while. Good luck
 

LAC_STS

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Re: First engine rebuild

I got the first round of stuff I ordered. I got the piston rings, and main and rod bearings.

I was looking at the piston rings and reading the directions that came with them and I noticed that one of the top rings is chipped on the bottom side of the rings.

photo3598x800.jpg


What do you guys think? This ring is no good? Should I return the ring set and get another?
 
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