Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

[macca123]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

I envy you, it has always been a dream of mine to build a plate aluminium boat around the 25 to 26ft mark, babies and other things got in the way, I will be following this thread with great interest, dare I say it as if it was my own.

regards

macca123

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Thanks Macca123.

I recieved an email from steve at HamiltonJet. He pointed me to Boatswains Locker in Orange County (CA not NY). I went to their website and they have a PDF form that I'll fill out tonight with the info they need to size the Jet properly and then give me pricing and ordering details.

I did discover that the HJ 212/213 are rated up to 350hp and I'll be in the 400hp range so I may need to step up to a bigger pump.

I should have mentioned this earlier but the reason for the bigger motor is not for speed, it's to be able to power through mud and silt without clogging up the pump. I've been through the clogged pump routine before with a small motor and a run of the mill Berkely pump. For some reason, it never happens when you're drifting up to the dock, it's always when you're headed out to fish at 4:00am in the dark and the beach is rocky.

All pumps will clog given enough silt and debri but this configuration should be far less prone.

Wow, there's a lot of stuff to investigate and learn in this project.!

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Great news, I finally found a dealer for Hamilton Jet pumps. I'd bet he can get me a Scott too if I decide to go that way. I'm still on the fence with that.

Ironically, it's the same shop (Jetstream Concepts) that fixed the gash in the bow of my 18 footer. Phil and Maggie Taylor are the owners and super folks to deal with. They're in Yuba City, Ca.

Big advantage in buying from Phil. First I'm a previous customer and I pay fast. Second if I buy the pump from Phil I know I can count on fantastic support for just about anything I need during this build.

So, yep, I'm all jacked up about that find!

As for the when I'll lay the keel.. That's still a ways off yet. Last weekend I did a lot more work on getting the shop and the half of the garage cleaned out and setup to handle a 21' 3" boat. I now have 12' in width with 9' in and out of the garage door but most important, with the storage cabinets out the garage door is now center of the space.

Hard to invision I bet but what it means it that I can put the build form on casters with levelers and move the boat in and out of the garage as needed.

I cut a hole out the back of the garage and boxed that in so now I have a clear 21' 6" end to end. That leaves me just 3" clearance and that's enough for the garage door to close. It's going to be tight and once it's turned it will have to go outside. I've got plans to put up a portable shelter when that time comes.

This weekend I'm going up to the lake at least one day but the rest of it I hope to be working on getting the wiring all replaced and put in conduit. This will help immensely with the A/C interference, now that I know the trick for keeping it under control. I just need to do it to code. I wouldn't want to have a fire and lose everything because the insurance won't cover it. I'll pull the permit on Friday.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

I've wanted to do something like this too, for quite a while. I'll be watching you go.

Do make the wiring to code... not only will it help with HF issues, but it will avoid potential fires and other problems that could endanger your hard work.

Nice welder... I've wanted to get rid of my chinese built TIG and get a nice heavy "real" welder... not going to be able to afford an inverter, I'm going to end up getting a 10 year old Hobart or Miller with a big transformer.

Are you going to hand cut the panels? I had envisioned building a CNC plasma cutter table then using that to cut them out - labor savings, more precision, and you can make another part if you mess the first one up.

Post lots of pics.

Erik

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Thanks Erik, regarding the welder, the Lincoln 225 is about like the Miller 212 is to MIG. I really like it.

Regarding the material cutting. I've got a Festool reciprocating saw and all the guides to go with it. I also have a horizontal band saw and a 20" vertical wide throat band saw converted for metal (gear reduction and motor covers).

I thought about a plasma cutter so I tried my brothers and I didn't like the edge. The reciprocating saw is the best at following a line and producing a clean edge. Fit-up is really important with TIG and it was obvious that I'd be spending a lot of time with a Vixen file if I used plasma. There's also more waste with plasma. Sometimes 1/16 of an inch can be the difference between one or two parts per sheet. The stuff is sold by the square inch so eliminating waste is very important.

I'm going to check with my supplier and see about having them cut the larger stuff on their water jet. This potentially could work out about the same since I wouldn't be paying for as much scrap. It's something I've been thinking about but I haven't talked to them yet.

Of course I reserve the right to change horses in the middle of the stream. It's my first time so what I'm pondering now may never come to fruition.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Whew, what a weekend. Went up to the lake to finish dialing in the jets on the FrankenMerc motor and finally hit the 8000 RPM mark, (info on that in the FrankenMerc thread).

Came home about noon and pulled the permit for the garage wiring. As of this moment I only have one 20amp 4 way to install and I have to pull the third sub-panel for the pool pumps. They'll just get disconnects near the pumps.

Everything is now all on one sub-panel. My Dad had a way of making things work when he needed them to but often they became permanent. I must have pulled out 300 ft of extension cords. I'll never want for one again!

The good news is that with the isolated grounds and everything in conduit now I get 5 bars on my notebook with the house wireless. I was lucky to get two before.

My welder no longer rings the house doorbells or turns on the sprinklers and the phones no longer have static on them.

So, all is good and I now have a 100amp service out to the garage and no more worries.

One of my buddies is the inspector for the City and he's comming by tomorrow for a barbeque and will sign it off and I'll be done with this portion of the project.

My only dilema is if I should charge this off to the boat project or not. What I found would have made my insurance null and void if I had a fire anytime so this work was something that had to be done boat or not. The boat just prompted a closer look. I'm thinking that for accuracy of costs it should not be included now.

Anyway, that's the update.. I'm beat, I think I'll go take a nap.

Steve

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Garage was inspected and signed off yesterday. Just got back from the city and my insurance guy and we're golden! I also sold another motor this morning. I'll hang it on his boat tonight and that will put me back in budget.

Project is on track but really boring for anybody but me. I'll try to liven it up with some pic's soon..

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Well this is cool... I sold a Merc 150 V-6 I had taken in on trade on Tuesday and today I found a Miller 212 MIG welder on CL for $1,000.00. I took a look at it and it's like new. It still had the plastic plugs in the gas fittings. It's in the back of my Tahoe right now.

It may seem like I'm going backwards from the logic I used of to justify TIG vs. MIG. I don't know, maybe I am. It was a little impulsive I guess but now I can do either so I feel like I just opened another door/opportunity to do a better job building this thing.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Whew, another weekend of busting it... I think I have the garage and the shop in shape now. I took measurements and I now have enough room for the build if I put the form on casters. It's not perfect but it will work.

Here's the welding station. Note all the extension cords, those are what I took out of the garage during the rewire.

And the workshop setup for workflow.

 

[sprintst]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Nice work man. You're all set.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Just a bump to let you know the project is still active - Lots of prep work going on. Education, organization and planning. I've been studying a lot of material on the subject and I'm finding a lot of eye openers. I'll post the references as I go.

 

[Huron Angler]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

For an ambitious project like this I don't blame you for keeping your ducks in a row before diving in. Looking forward to seeing how you tackle the challenges ahead of you.

I'm sure it will turn out great with your track record.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

I ordered the spool gun for the MIG welder today. 520.77 to the door from Indiana Oxygen on eBay. I was bidding on a used one but the selling price went over 300.00 so I let it go. It went for around 450.00 and for the life of me I can't figure out why. There's no warranty and it was being sold as is. To me that's just plain dumb when you can get a new one for another 100.00.

I have my 18' MonArk up for sale on CraigsList for 8,000.00. I'd like to get it out of the garage because I'm anxious to get started. I refuse to put it outside all winter and there's no reasonable indoor storage anywhere nearby. I'm going to keep using it though.. Going fishing on Sunday...

If it sells then great but if not, I'll just have to figure something out or wait till spring to start. I love that boat and the engine is such a sweatheart. I hate to sell it but I can't figure out any other way around it. Sucks...

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Last night I was getting some seat time with the TIG welder and I was welding some thin Aluminum. I got to thinking why not build the boat in 1/12 or 1/6 scale first then build it full scale. I know a lot of builders do this and it makes sense. I might just do it.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Yeah, it sure makes things come out better fit and assembly wise when you do a model first.

But I'd recommend something like 1:10 or 1:15 scale... the smaller it is the easier/quicker the model goes.

If you're thinking of using it for welding practice, it's actually of limited use since you need to proportionally reduce the thickness of the aluminum or else spend a lot of work cutting those small pieces to size. Thinner aluminum welds easier/with less amperage.

If you want practice there are a ton of great starter projects out there on vendor web sites and others. Make up an aluminum welding cart, that's usually the first project

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Yeah, it sure makes things come out better fit and assembly wise when you do a model first.

But I'd recommend something like 1:10 or 1:15 scale... the smaller it is the easier/quicker the model goes.

If you're thinking of using it for welding practice, it's actually of limited use since you need to proportionally reduce the thickness of the aluminum or else spend a lot of work cutting those small pieces to size. Thinner aluminum welds easier/with less amperage.

If you want practice there are a ton of great starter projects out there on vendor web sites and others. Make up an aluminum welding cart, that's usually the first project

Thanks Erik, yep I've got all the Aluminum projects I need right now. TIG'n this stuff to scale using scaled down thicknesses will put me in the tin foil range. I've done that parlor trick along with the razor blades and coke cans.

I'm going with 1/12 since that's what the plans are and it's saves work and mistakes doing the conversion.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Well, not much boat buidling news.. I did get the Miller 3035 spool gun last night and hooked it all up to my Miller 212. Pretty sweet, just grab a gun and weld away.

The last time I used a spool gun the results were fair to midland and I wasn't all that sure about trying it again. However, I've spent more than a couple of hours trying to learn TIG welding and it's suprising how much of that knowledge carries over into MIG/Spool Gun Aluminum spray welding. I layed down several good looking stacked dime welds with the gun.

They looked good enough but I prefer the looks of the TIG weld hands down and I also feel that the TIG weld is a better weld. When it comes to the critical welds they will be TIG and the long and not so critical will be MIG.

I started practicing on some really thin Aluminum for the model boat last night. It's not going to be easy to learn to weld this thin stuff.

Yes, I can weld beer cans, razor blades and tin foil. Nice tricks but don't serve much in the way of learning once you know how they're done. Next time someone say's they can do those things throw a couple of pieces of .040 angle at them and tell them to butt weld it... You'll have them sweatin I guarantee it.

Anyway, I took my MonArk out Sunday. It was windy and rough but I found a smooth spot so I nailed it. Problem was that I forgot the Bimini was up and I snapped the uprights. I don't know how fast I was going when it snapped. It's only rated to 35mph. I'll make a new frame out of some 3/4" Schedule 80 pipe this comming weekend.

One last update, I did buy my brothers Miller Spectrum 375 plasma cutter but I don't have it yet. It'll do up to 1/4" plate or a 5/8 sheer cut so it should be fine for this project.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

Well my brother flaked on me so I just ordered and Everlast Plasma cutter. I didn't do this lightly and I'm still a little shakey about buying a Everlast vs. a major name brand. I'll let you all know how it works out and maybe, just maybe I've found a way to save a 1000.00..

 

[sschefer]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

So far so good on the Plasma Cutter. They shipped it out yesterday and it will be there when I get home tonight. That's a quick tip for ya'll... If the shipping location is within 75 miles, never pay for overnight, just pay for ground and you'll get it the next day anyway.

Those of you who are retired would probably say, "why didn't you just go pick it up".. Well, I'm not retired, the trip is about 150 miles round trip, I didn't have any work scheduled in the area, gas is 3.00+ per gallon, I get 14 mi per gallon in my Tahoe, I bill out at 225.00 an hour and they paid for shipping. I know, free shipping is an oxymoron, you pay it in the cost of the unit but it sounds good!

This is actually a pretty good test. I now know that they weren't blowing smoke up my .... when they said they were where they were and I can get parts overnight with just a phone call if I need them. That can be a job saver in its own.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Glen-L 21' Canyon Cruiser - Aluminum

I've heard nothing but good things about the Everlast product line. They're supposed to be a cut above the (other?)Chinese imports. There's a guy on Youtube who does some TIG welding videos using one of their units.

If I were going to buy a new TIG welder as opposed to a used model, I'd buy an Everlast.

Erik