War in Iraq

Haut Medoc

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Re: War in Iraq

Sorry to make light of "The War(s) of the Roses"....Or the "Roundheads"/ New model army, (We Have an 'Ollie' as well.. :) ...The British Isles have certainly seen more than their share of strife.. :( & emerged to become one of the most powerful nations on this rock.... :) I agree with all that you have said....We need to enable the Iraqi people to govern themselves...If it takes the torture that both of our countries endured ....(through civil war) Then maybe that it what it willl take.....It seems that history does repeat itself, regardless of geographical location...We can only try to moderate now....We have the power to commit genocide, but choose not to do that....Hopefully the Iraqis will choose life as well...Before they squander lives uselessly as well. I think that the majority wants to eat, work & send their kids to school, just like we do...JK
 

stan_deezy

Lieutenant Commander
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Oct 18, 2003
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1,539
Re: War in Iraq

'ere Nos don't get me started on bleeding ROE :mad: <br />Politicians handcuffing our lads hands in foreign lands :mad: <br />Only decent polictico we had in recent years was Paddy Pantsdown and that was only because he was ex-Royal Marine :D and "allegedly" a sneaky beaky to boot :cool: <br /><br />Support for the English Parliament, me? Yeah of course. I signed up to serve HM Queen and Country so I guess that includes wotever government Auntie Liz wants too.<br /><br />Looking on the bright side we got our own parliament now. Just a pity it don't have any powers :D <br /><br />Iraq: lets take the gloves off and get the job finished :cool: <br /><br />JK. I agree, sometimes civil wars are the only way to get the democracy or whatever it is that the country wants. Perhaps the politicians on both sides of the Pond should be forced to sit some History lessons soon?
 

Skinnywater

Commander
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Mar 7, 2002
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Re: War in Iraq

Ahoy txwinner, have you been able to glean any knowledge from our participation in your thread?
 

Dunaruna

Admiral
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Re: War in Iraq

Originally posted by PW2:<br /> ..... but he did say the leader of Iran is trying to get nuclear weapons (No surprise there) and he (Iranian leader) came out on the record saying Israel should be wiped off the face of the earth......<br /><br />
I saw the news grab where Ahmadinejad made those comments. I am very surprised that the news services haven't run rampant with it - it is virtually a public declaration of war.
 

12Footer

Fleet Admiral
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Messages
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Re: War in Iraq

Originally posted by J.kopec:<br /> Seems like "Rummy" likes Saddam just fine :rolleyes: :eek: :) :D :confused: Hypocrites, I tell ya!.....JK
Have you heard from your friendly niegborhood hypocrat lately?<br /><br /><br /> <br />October 9th, 1999 Letter to President Clinton Signed by democrat Senators Levin, Lieberman, Lautenberg, Dodd, Kerrey, Feinstein, Mikulski, Daschle, Breaux, Johnson, Inouye, Landrieu, Ford and Kerry <br />"We urge you, after consulting with Congress and consistent with the US Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions, including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs." <br /> <br />Joe Biden > August 4, 2002 <br />"This is a guy who is an extreme danger to the world, and this is a guy who is in every way possible seeking weapons of mass destruction." <br /><br />Al Gore > December 16, 1998 <br />"f you allow someone like Saddam Hussein to get nuclear weapons, ballistic missiles, chemical weapons, biological weapons, how many people is he going to kill with such weapons? He has already demonstrated a willingness to use such weapons..." <br /><br />John Kerry > January 23, 2003 <br />"Without question we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator leading an impressive regime. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation. And now he's miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction. His consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction." <br /><br /> Sandy Berger > February 18, 1998 <br />"He'll use those weapons of mass destruction again as he has 10 times since 1983." <br />Senator Carl Levin > September 19, 2002 <br />"We begin with a common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations, is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them." <br /><br />Senator Hillary Clinton > October 10, 2002 <br />"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock. His missile delivery capability, his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists including Al-Qaeda members. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."<br /> <br />Madeleine Albright > November 10, 1999 <br />"Hussein has chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies." <br /> <br />Robert Byrd > October 3, 2002 <br />"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of '98. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons."<br /> <br />Al Gore > September 23, 2002 <br />"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter, and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power." <br /><br />Joe Biden > August 4, 2002 <br />"I think he has anthrax. I have not seen any evidence that he has smallpox, but you hear them say, Tim (Russert), is the last smallpox outbreak in the world was in Iraq; ergo, he may have a strain."<br /> <br />Bill Clinton > December 17, 1998 <br />"Earlier today, I ordered America's armed forces to strike military and security targets in Iraq.... Their mission is to attack Iraq's nuclear, chemical and biological weapons programs and its military capacity to threaten its neighbors." <br /> <br />Hillary Clinton > October 10, 2002 <br />"In the four years since the inspections, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability and his nuclear program." <br /> <br />**** Gephardt > September 23, 2002 <br />"(I have seen) a large body of intelligence information over a long time that he is working on and has weapons of mass destruction. Before 1991, he was close to a nuclear device. Now, you'll get a debate about whether it's one year away or five years away." <br /> <br />Russell Feingold > October 9, 2002 <br />"With regard to Iraq, I agree Iraq presents a genuine threat, especially in the form of weapons of mass destruction: chemical, biological and potentially nuclear weapons. I agree that Saddam Hussein is exceptionally dangerous and brutal, if not uniquely so, as the president argues."<br /> <br />Johnny Edwards > January 7, 2003 <br />"Serving on the intelligence committee and seeing day after day, week after week, briefings on Saddam's weapons of mass destruction and his plans on using those weapons, he cannot be allowed to have nuclear weapons. It's just that simple. The whole world changes if Saddam ever has nuclear weapons." <br /><br />John Kerry > January 31, 2003 <br />"If you don't believe...Saddam Hussein <br />is a threat with nuclear weapons, then <br />you shouldn't vote for me." <br /> <br />Bill Nelson > September 14, 2002 <br />"I believe he has chemical and biological weapons. I think he's trying to develop nuclear weapons, and the fact that he might use those is a considerable threat to us." <br /><br />Al Gore > September 23, 2002 <br />"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country." <br /><br />Tom Daschle > February 11, 1998 <br />"The (Clinton) administration has said, 'Look, we have exhausted virtually our diplomatic effort to get the Iraqis to comply with their own agreements and with international law. Given that, what other option is there but to force them to do so?' That's what they're saying. This is the key question. And the answer is we don't have another option. We have got to force them to comply, and we are doing so militarily." <br /><br />Bill Richardson > May 29, 1998 <br />"The threat of nuclear proliferation is one of the big challenges that we have now, especially y states that have nuclear weapons, outlaw states like Iraq."<br /> <br />Hillary Clinton > October 10, 2002 <br />"It is clear, however, that if left unchecked Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capability to wage biological and chemical warfare and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."<br /> <br />Bill Clinton > February 17, 1998 <br />"If Saddam rejects peace, and we have to use force, our purpose is clear: We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program." <br /> <br />Madeleine Albright > February 1, 1998<br />"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and the security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."<br /><br />Nancy Pelosi > December 16, 1998 <br />"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology, which is a threat to countries in the region, and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process." <br /><br />Al Gore > September 23, 2002<br />"We know that he has stored nuclear supplies, secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country." <br /><br />John Kerry > October 9, 2002 <br />"I will be voting to give the president of the US the authority to use force if necessary to disarm Saddam because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."<br /> <br />Ted Kennedy > September 27, 2002 <br />"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction." <br /><br />Jay Rockefeller > October 10, 2002 <br />"There was unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years. We also should remember that we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."<br /><br />Joe Biden > August 4, 2002 <br />"[H]e does have the capacity, as all terrorist-related operations do, of smuggling stuff into the United States and doing something terrible. That is true. But there's been no connection, hard connection made yet between he and al-Qaida or his willingness or effort to do that thus far. Doesn't mean he won't. This is a bad guy."<br /> <br />Madeline Albright > February 18, 2002 <br />Iraq is a long way from (here), but what happens there matters a great deal here, for the risk that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest national security threat we face -- and it is a threat against which we must and will stand firm." <br /><br />Jane Harman > August 27, 2002 <br />"I certainly think (Hussein's) developing nuclear capability which, fortunately, the Israelis set back 20 years ago with their preemptive attack which, in hindsight, looks pretty darn good."<br /> <br />**** Durbin > September 30, 1999 <br />"One of the most compelling threats we in this country face today is the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction. Threat assessments regularly warn us of the possibility that North Korea, Iran, Iraq, or some other nation may acquire or develop nuclear weapons."<br /> <br />Bill Nelson > August 25, 2002 <br />"My own personal view is, I think Saddam <br />has chemical and biological weapons, <br />and I expect that he is trying to develop <br />a nuclear weapon. So at some point, <br />we might have to act precipitously." <br /><br />Nancy Pelosi > October 10, 2002 <br />"Yes, he has chemical weapons. Yes, he has biological weapons. He is trying to get nuclear weapons." <br />Evan Bayh > August 4, 2002 <br />"I'm inclined to support going in there and dealing with Saddam, but I think that case <br />needs to be made on a separate basis: his possession of biological and chemical weapons, his desire to get nuclear weapons, his proven track record of attacking his neighbors and others." <br /><br />Bill Clinton > February 17, 1998 <br />"We have to defend our future from these predators of the 21st Century.... They will be all the more lethal if we allow them to build arsenals of nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons and the missiles to deliver them. We simply cannot allow that to happen. There is no more clear example of this threat than Saddam Hussein." <br /><br />Hillary Clinton > January 22, 2003 <br />"I voted for the Iraqi resolution. I consider the prospect of a nuclear-armed Saddam Hussein who can threaten not only his neighbors but the stability of the region and the world, a very serious threat to the United States." <br /><br />Joe Biden > August 4, 2002 <br />"We know he continues to attempt to gain access to additional capability, including nuclear capability."<br /><br />Johnny Edwards > February 6, 2003 <br />"The question is whether we're going to allow this man who's been developing weapons of mass destruction continue to develop weapons of mass destruction, get nuclear capability and get to the place where -- if we're going to stop him if he invades a country around him -- it'll cost millions of lives as opposed to thousands of lives." <br /><br />Joe Biden > August 4, 2002 <br />"First of all, we don't know exactly what he has. It's been five years since inspectors have been in there, number one. Number two, it is clear that he has residual of chemical weapons and biological weapons, number one."<br /> <br />Senator Bob Graham > December 8, 2002 <br />"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has and has had for a number of years a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction." <br /><br />John Kerry > February 23, 1998 <br />"Saddam Hussein has already used these weapons and has made it clear that he has the intent to continue to try, by virtue of his duplicity and secrecy, to continue to do so. That is a threat to the stability of the Middle East. It is a threat with respect to the potential of terrorist activities on a global basis. It is a threat even to regions near but not exactly in the Middle East."
 

12Footer

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Re: War in Iraq

It would appear that there has been a calculated set-up by the left here. Unfortunately, their belief that all conservatives are forgetful idiots is as valid as their belief in Robyn Hood economics.
 

PW2

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Re: War in Iraq

What' your point, 12 footer.?<br /><br />This discussions has long ago left the wmd argument behind, to question how the war is progressing, and what we should do next.<br /><br />In case you had not noticed we are in the war now, and it is not only the democrats that are questioning how it is going.
 

Skinnywater

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Mar 7, 2002
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Re: War in Iraq

The only WMD arguements that can be made is that we didn't get them back from Saddam and we don't know where they are.<br />And it isn't a priority anymore to keep them from the hands of terrorists.
 

Haut Medoc

Supreme Mariner
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Jun 29, 2004
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Re: War in Iraq

Hypocrites on both sides, my friend.....If it existed, where is it now? The present admin can't find it's own a$$ with as many arms as Shiva has, Mapquest & a note from his Mommy....JK
 

rodbolt

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Sep 1, 2003
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Re: War in Iraq

wow a rehub with a conspiracy theory. man aint that a twist :) :)
 

deputydawg

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Re: War in Iraq

With over 2000 lives lost.....in how many years is that? How many murders in the U.S. in the same time frame? Compare a war zone to a peacful country, someone must be doing something right.<br /><br />Doesn't anyone remember the short blip on the media when we were first hunting for WMD's in Iraq? The convoy headed to the Pakistan border? That was when the weapons inspectors tried to get to Pakistan to see what was being hauled over and Pakistan turned them away. I am sure it was a shipment of Jell-o or something. Saddam had the ability to produce weapons and refused to give up that ability, and refused to have it monitored.<br /><br />Remember too we have been looking for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq less time than it took Hillary Clinton to find the Rose law firm billing records.<br />Elections, schools being built, hospitals built, oh yeah and that little thing about the evil dictator who slaughtered 200,000 innocent men women and children....<br /><br />Remember Hilter, he never attacked the U.S. Japan did. <br /><br />I for one think he is doing an excelent job. Life in the political world is not as clear as people think. There are motivators everywhere "other than oil and money people are stuck on". There is a reason we are staying out of Pakistan, only we as citizens don't have a need to know or right to know. I also do not realy want to know. Yes the president is commander in chief and all that, but it really does not give as much power as people may think. <br /><br />Just like years ago when Clinten was offered Osama Bin ladens head on a platter multiple times by the Sudan, he declined for whatever reasons including he was a bleeding heart whimp. I am sure there would have been political ramifications from accepting. Look at the lived he could have saved by accepting the offer to be rid of 1 man? <br /><br />What do I think of the Presidence of The United States? I think he doing an awsome job, he just needs to stop worrying about opinion and finish the game. His military leaders did not have a good exit plan, as far as we common citizens know, but still doing a wonderful job.<br /><br />When it is said this is taking too long, what do we expect. <br /><br />I know I will never change anyones opinion on this subject. When it comes to war people are set in their ways and will not change. But that is one of the great things about our country, we all have the option of forming our own opinion then voicing that opinion. That freedom won by war, and paid for in blood of our citizens in an unpopular war.
 

rolmops

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Feb 24, 2002
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Re: War in Iraq

Please help me out here.Where does Iraq share a border with Pakistan???????????
 

Haut Medoc

Supreme Mariner
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Jun 29, 2004
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Re: War in Iraq

Nowhere....DD, needs to hit the geography book.....JK
 

alumistar

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Nov 23, 2003
Messages
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Re: War in Iraq

as far as i'm concerned, politics have fallen through completely. no doubt, we do not need to be there NOW! when we went in the first place, i believe, we should have stayed in afganistan. think about this. did saddam bomb our WTC or was it the other guy, that we kinda stopped looking for? you know, binLaden! was there an alterior motive for us to get over there in that part of the world? oil? hmmmmmm..........let's see, who is the most desireable, least political target that the world would sort of forget after a while? i guess it's Iraq! BTW, didn't we have something to do with Saddam coming into power in the first place like 20+ years ago?
 

alumistar

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Nov 23, 2003
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154
Re: War in Iraq

p.s. what ever happened to the threat from North Korea?
 

JustMrWill

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Aug 12, 2003
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Re: War in Iraq

Originally posted by J.kopec:<br /> Anyone (almost) will be a communist or (pick it) with a boot on your neck & a gun to your head..Babies need to be spoon fed, but will grow into adults with the proper nurturing....JK
Guess the same could be said for Democracy....wait...15-20 more years of spoon feeding them with a gun to their heads - then we will see...<br /><br />At 2000 Americans dead in 2.5 years...that will only be 2000/2.5=800 per year...so 800x20= 16,000 AMERICANS dead...not too bad. <br />Now..don't forget the crippled and wounded...that is a measly 15,000...that will only be at 120,000 in 20 years...still acceptable loses.<br /><br />-JMW
 

Haut Medoc

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Joined
Jun 29, 2004
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Re: War in Iraq

I will always believe that it is basic human nature to want to be free....Let's call our "little mission" an exercise in behavior modification....Even one dead soldier is one too many,IMHO..... However, To pull out now would accomplish nothing....Except that those 2,000 + lives were wasted needlessly....I personally don't think we should have been there in the first place, but.....We have to finish what we started or these people will have died in vain....JK
 
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